Derby News Network Power Rankings - June 2010
| DNN | WFTDA | W/L | Next | Notes | ||||
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
|
1 E | 2010 1-0 2009 7-2 |
6/25 @ Windy City | No action in May, but their 201-75 blowout win over tough Charm City keeps them in the top spot. We'll get some more data at the end of June as Gotham takes on Boston and Windy City. | ||||
|
1 W | 2010 6-0 2009 12-0 |
6/5 vs Texas | In May, Oly held off Rocky Mountain in the toughest challenge they've faced since a last-jam win over Rose City at February's Wild West Showdown. Still undefeated since January 2009, they will tie Gotham's WFTDA-record 18-game winning streak if they can take down Texas on June 5. | ||||
|
|
3 W | 2010 6-1 2009 8-7 |
6/5 vs Charm City | Rocky Mountain moves to their highest perch ever on the strength of a massive defeat of previous #3 Texas, 163-64. | ||||
|
2 W | 2010 5-2 2009 12-3 |
6/12 vs Rat City | After a May defeat of Texas, Denver stays put at #4 as Texas passes them on the way down but Rocky Mountain passes them on the way up. | ||||
|
|
4 W | 2010 4-2 2009 5-3 |
6/26 @ Carolina | Rose City defeated regional rival Rat City but lost to Rocky Mountain in May in two narrow matches, keeping them right in the middle of the hunt of a very closely matched top 5 of the Western Region. | ||||
|
5 W | 2010 4-2 2009 5-7 |
6/6 vs Texas | Rat City dropped fairly close ones to Rocky Mountain and Rose City in May, but they pick up a spot as Texas drops down the top 10. They'll go head to head with Texas on June 6 and also take on West Region rival Denver later this month. | ||||
|
2 E | 2010 3-3 2009 9-2 |
6/20 @ Denver | Solidly defeated Detroit in May, and rises to the 7 slot on the Texas drop. This month they'll host the 4th East Coast Extravaganza, where they'll go up against Windy City in a rematch of one of the closest games of 2009. | ||||
|
1 SC | 2010 3-2 2009 11-2 |
6/5 @ Oly | Texas takes the most precipitous drop of their long history after taking it on the chin from Rocky Mountain by 99 points in May. However, they get a chance to immediately get back up when they take on Oly and Rat City on June 5th and 6th. | ||||
|
|
1 NC | 2010 2-0 2009 10-2 |
6/25 @ Gotham | Windy City finally kicked off their 2010 action with wins over North Star and Madison, but their surprisingly narrow win over Madison (115-104) suggests that their hold on the North Central may not be as secure as it has been in the last two years. | ||||
|
2 NC | 2010 0-3 2009 7-4 |
6/26 vs Detroit | Madison bumps up a slot over Charm City with an impressive showing against Windy City; when Madison and WCR faced off at 2009 NC Regionals, WCR won by 94, but last month at the Midwest Brewhaha, Madison came within 11 points. | ||||
|
4 E | 2010 2-4 2009 13-5 |
6/5 @ Rocky Mountain | No action in May, but the Baltimore crew drops one slot as they swap spots with Madison. Charm has two big chances to climb this month, though, traveling to Rocky Mountain and Texas for out-of-region tests. | ||||
|
3 NC | 2010 7-1 2009 8-6 |
6/5 vs Pickup Teams | Philly ended Detroit's 4-game winning streak in May, but they hold steady at #12. | ||||
|
3 E | 2010 3-2 2009 10-9 |
6/19 vs Denver | A big loss to Oly and a big win over Montreal reflect Boston's placement between them; no movement since May for the Massacre, but a very busy June that includes Denver, Gotham and Rose City bouts should dial them in well as the WFTDA quarter closes. | ||||
|
- | 2010 6-0 2009 8-3 |
6/5 @ Bakersfield | No action or movement for the hybrid SoCal league, but the June 5th weekend sees them participating in the yearly unofficial California state championship, the Big One tournament. | ||||
|
5 E | 2010 7-2 2009 11-3 |
6/5 @ Houston | Steel City made a serious statement at early May's Spring Roll, hanging right with Detroit until the last few minutes of the bout, and nudges up a spot over London. | ||||
|
- | 2010 2-2 2009 5-0 |
TBD | No action in May after their stateside swing in April, and it's uncertain when we'll get a chance to see this team in action again, what with all the water in the way and stuff. | ||||
|
5 SC | 2010 4-0 2009 8-5 |
6/12 @ Hard Knox | 5-0 on the year so far, Nashville will be playing mostly lowly-ranked teams until their SC regional tournament, but they stay a narrow step ahead of Atlanta based on their February head-to-head win. | ||||
|
3 SC | 2010 7-2 2009 8-8 |
6/26 vs Cincinnati | Atlanta became the first non-Texas South Central team to defeat perennial Nationals-level team Kansas City in May, and seems to be on a collision course with Nashville at this year's SC Regionals. | ||||
|
4 NC | 2010 7-1 2009 10-5 |
6/19 vs Brewcity | Cincy's only loss this year has come to non-WFTDA San Diego. On June 26 they'll be looking to take Atlanta's #18 slot away from them. Cincy solidly won their 2009 match, 121-64. | ||||
|
4 SC | 2010 9-5 2009 7-3 |
6/26 @ Hard Knox | Only action in May was an expected rout of Northwest Arkansas, 193-47, so Dallas holds steady at 20. | ||||
|
7 W | 2010 2-2 2009 5-5 |
6/5 @ Humboldt | A combination of a solid win over Sacred City and a big loss for Duke City against Denver moves Bay Area up a notch; matches against Providence and Philly at ECE give them a chance to continue upward movement. | ||||
|
6 W | 2010 6-4 2009 5-8 |
6/5 @ Arch Rivals | Duke City ran into the Denver buzzsaw in May, going down to the biggest loss of their history, 262-48; they slip a spot as Bay Area switches places with them. | ||||
|
2 SC | 2010 1-1 2009 9-4 |
6/12 vs Northwest Arkansas | A WFTDA-rankings upset loss to Atlanta means that Kansas City may have a tougher road than last year through the South Central tournament. Before that, though, they'll take an out-of-region trip to Baltimore to go up against Charm City. | ||||
|
9 E | 2010 9-3 2009 5-6 |
6/26 @ Dominion | After debuting last month, Montreal ticks up one more spot on the strength of a surprisingly big win over unranked Dutchland. Boston solidly stopped their 7-game WFTDA win streak, though, 111-58. | ||||
|
5 NC | 2010 4-2 2009 6-4 |
6/19 @ Cincinnati | Now 4-0 on the year, Brewcity returns to the top 25 after a short absence with the help of a 99-point drubbing of unranked but improving Tampa Bay. They have a big chance to jump with a date against #19 Cincinnati on June 19. | ||||
| Key: | |
| E | WFTDA East region |
| W | WFTDA West region |
| NC | WFTDA North Central region |
| SC | WFTDA South Central region |
Comments
WHAT?!
IT'S AN OUTRAGE!
*chuckle* I've always wanted to do that.
WHAT??? NOW THAT *IS* AN
WHAT??? NOW THAT *IS* AN OUTRAGE, I TELL YOU!!!
Before you ask...
... yes, we know the win-loss records are still broken. They're pulling data from a database that is still crawling its way out of beta. If you'll just have a little patience, everything on DNN will be perfect forever.
philly's next bout
is 6/20 against denver in a hangover bout in boston. (not 6/5)
West Region Power!
Buy your tix for Western Regionals now! According to the above, you may see more high level matchups in Sacramento than in Chicago this year..
Hmm...
I'm not saying that Oly is better than Gotham or that you're wrong, but...
"For the moment, though, we're sticking with our impression from April, which was that Gotham's 201-75 steamrolling of Charm City a week before Oly beat Charm by a much more respectable final of 156-102 suggests that Gotham has the edge right now."
Come on. Anyone comparing Oly's point spreads to anyone else's clearly isn't paying attention. Their biggest blowouts against top tier teams were the two final games of last year which were 87 and 78 points which is fairly modest in today's derby. Just look at their scores, they beat every top 25 team they play in the 30-70 point range, no matter their level of play. It's clear that Oly either a. plays down to their level of competition or b. is very uncomfortable blowing teams out of the water or c. a combination of the two. I'm going to say its the first one and they stepped up their game in the semifinals and finals last year since so much more was on the line than a regular season game so they were a little more focused.
Again, not saying you're wrong about where you rank the two teams but triangulation makes ZERO sense in this situation, not that ever makes a ton of sense, but especially when discussing Oly.
by 30-70, you mean...?
Not to get all anal about the facts, but Oly beat Rose by 8 and Rocky by 20. I'm thinking those close margins were not the result of them "playing down to their level of competition".
That said, I still think playing only one bout in 5 months should give you a ranking of "unknown" rather than #1. :-)
More on point spreads
Come on. Anyone comparing Oly's point spreads to anyone else's clearly isn't paying attention.
Trust me on this at least: we're paying attention :)
I'm glad you brought this up because I've been thinking about how to phrase this for awhile and have been having trouble with it ...
I think that there may be some confusion about how we use point spreads and triangulation. It's easy shorthand for us to say "Team X beat Team Y by 50, but Team Z beat Team Y by 80, so we think Team Z is better." What is more important when we're coming up with these is "How late was the bout still in question?" which is reflected in the point spreads but not necessarily always crystal clear in just those cold numbers. It's a *lot* easier to judge this when you see a bout in person than via recap or liveblog, which is why we try really hard to get one of us to any top-ten bout whenever feasible.
Since we're talking about Oly, a good example of this would be Oly's bouts vs. Charm City and Boston recently. The final point spreads were pretty close -- Oly by 54 over Charm and by 65 over Boston, just a jam's worth of points. However, Oly quickly opened up a 30 point lead to start their bout against Boston, held it for the majority of the first half while consistently calling off jams without getting their potential maximum points, and then steadily increased it throughout the second half. With 10 minutes to go it was essentially over at Oly 103 Boston 49, especially considering that Boston never had better than a 10-0 jam.
While I definitely wouldn't say they were "taking it easy" on Boston, there was never a point where Boston was seriously coming back, they were just mostly avoiding falling further behind.
In the Charm City bout, Charm was within 17 points at halftime, 20 points with 15 minutes to go and 31 points (still on the outside edge of possibility, especially considering that Charm had racked a 19-0 in the first half) with 7 minutes to go, with Oly usually looking to maximize jam differential rather than settling for 2-0 or 3-0. So, while the final point margins in those two games only ended up being 11 points different, it sure looked to me (as I was at both games) like Oly had a considerably tougher time against Charm, and did not appear to be actively choosing to play in a way that would lead to a lower point differential.
Moving over to the Gotham bout, it was crystal clear that about 15 minutes into the bout, Gotham began to absolutely shut Charm City down. Over the middle half hour of the game, the score went from 44-30 Gotham to 89-34 at halftime and 154-45 with 15 minutes to play. Notably, Joy Collision was the *only* jammer on Charm City to score any points at all during that stretch. With that final score of 201-75, Charm City scored the majority of their points after the outcome was a foregone conclusion.
Now, yes, you could argue that if Gotham had chosen to call all those jams at 5-0, the final score would have been much closer. But again, the real issue reflected by point spreads is "how late in the game did the losing team still have a reasonable chance at the victory?" That point came way, way later in Charm vs. Oly than Charm vs. Gotham. That's a big factor.
So, why not say in your
So, why not say in your description that Oly/Charm was still in question late in the game whereas Gotham was a blowout from the start rather than just comparing the scores?
perfectly reasonable question
... the answer to which, sometimes, is that we want to get it posted! We could probably write 500 words on our thinking on every team, every month, but we've got other things to do, like get this weekend's live coverage prepped, sort out logistical details for three gigantic events in the next three weeks, etc etc.
I think it's fair to say that "triangulation" plays a much larger role in our brief comments than it does in our considered ranking, and that's largely because it is by far the easiest to discuss concisely. As Justice pointed out in his elaborate comment, there's always more to it.
We'll strive to provide greater insight into our thinking in the future, but please rest assured that we put a *lot* of serious thought into this, and we have between us arguably more broad-based experience watching the full spectrum of the sport that just about anyone else. While it's not easy put into words, we feel like we have learned to tell the difference between a team that has been relatively inactive and is falling behind as a result (see Madison and Minnesota ca. 2007), vs. a team that hasn't played out much but has their finger on the pulse and is training accordingly -- see Rat City 2007, Windy City 2008, and (we feel) Gotham today.
That said, the only thing we love more than being right, is being gloriously wrong, when someone exceeds our expectations to just shine at this sport! How can anyone not love that?
Hmmm...
... the answer to which, sometimes, is that we want to get it posted! We could probably write 500 words on our thinking on every team, every month, but we've got other things to do,
Hurt, if you really need help cranking out 500+ word essays on anything remotely derby related, I'm sure someone could...
Nah, you know, I really can't think of anyone who's into doing that.
My money is on Oly.....ranking spankings
The final point spreads were pretty close -- Oly by 54 over Charm and by 65 over Boston, just a jam's worth of points. (WOW, and) But again, the real issue reflected by point spreads is "how late in the game did the losing team still have a reasonable chance at the victory?" That point came way, way later in Charm vs. Oly than Charm vs. Gotham. That's a big factor.
Justice I completely understand. ONE bout is enough empirical data needed to move an UNDEFEATED TEAM (who beat Gotham by the way) out of 1st place. WE get it.
2010 Gotham 1-0
#11 Charm (+126)
#13 Boston (?)
2010 Oly
# 5 Rose (+8)
#7 Philly (+66)
#10 Mad (+51)
#11 Charm (+54)
#13 Boston (+65)
#3 Rocky (+20)
#8 Texas (?)
If I was a betting man. My money is on OLY.
...
A jam's worth of points.
The final point spreads were pretty close -- Oly by 54 over Charm and by 65 over Boston, just a jam's worth of points. (WOW, and)
I think you misread that section you quoted right there. "Just a jam's worth of points" is referring to the 11-point difference between the Charm and Boston margins. What I was getting at is that although the final point spreads were very similar, they were fairly different games competitively.
Heading West..
The final point spreads were pretty close -- Oly by 54 over Charm and by 65 over Boston, just a jam's worth of points. (WOW, and)
I think you misread that section you quoted right there. "Just a jam's worth of points" is referring to the 11-point difference between the Charm and Boston margins. What I was getting at is that although the final point spreads were very similar, they were fairly different games competitively.
I totally misread that. I apologize for that.
I do want to mention how Charm and Boston are both heading WEST(Charm, again) to prepare themselves for their regional tournament. I really admire their tenacity to take on the best, because it will totally reap dividends for them come Easterns.
So I assume...
we'll see you in Portland in August when Gotham takes on Bay Area, Rose City and Rat City?
I should have been more
I should have been more clear (and hit the reply button, I guess), but I didn't mean 30-70 exactly but just in that general area which would include 20 and 73. The only outlier after their first few games as a WFTDA team is the Rose City game this year.
I guess I just could have said 20-75, but whatev.
Nasvhille/Atlanta collision
I CANNOT wait to watch. I have never watched a boring game between these two teams. Going to start watching plane tickets from Huntsville to Lincoln, NE right now.
True is!
I love you Femi!
Concurrence
:-))
Rematch!
I think we're all ready for a re-match! Maybe the champ bout at South Central Regionals? :-D
-Shannihilator
Atlanta Rollergirls
i can live with that.
i can live with that.
?
OLY ROLLERS
12-0 (Westerns to Present)
Total Score Diff 625
Avg Score Diff/Bout 52.1
Wins 17
Losses 0
Gotham
6-2 (Easterns to Present)
Total Score Diff 500
Avg Score Diff/Bout 83.3
Wins 26
Losses 7
Who knows what they are looking at when they rank Gotham #1. But it definitely controversial.
BUT GO WESTERN POWER!
it's a conspiracy
OLY ROLLERS
12-0 (Westerns to Present)
Total Score Diff 625
Avg Score Diff/Bout 52.1
Wins 17
Losses 0
Gotham
6-2 (Easterns to Present)
Total Score Diff 500
Avg Score Diff/Bout 83.3
Wins 26
Losses 7
Who knows what they are looking at when they rank Gotham #1. But it definitely controversial.
BUT GO WESTERN POWER!
This Oly vs Gotham who-is-really-#1 discussion reminds me of when Texas and Tucson were too obsessed w/ each other to recognize Rat City's threat at Dust Devil '07. Or when Rat City and Texas were so focused on each other they failed to predict Kansas City's performance at the following Nationals. I'm beginning to wonder if a talented but undervalued team paid DNN off to continue the argument so they can surreptitiously sweep it this year.
Let the conspiracy theory speculation begin! (because really, what else are we going to do until they release July rankings?)
ooh its just us fans....
Oly and I am sure Gotham don't give a f*ck. All Oly cares about is kicking everyone's butt who steps on the track with them, and PSOD is next and then Jet City, and then....
But I would love to see some team come out of the wood work, problem is the majority of the strong teams are in the West and East and they are going to beat each other up. What we might see is an exciting undervalued team upset a team for that #3 spot in those tourneys. Now the South and North we are going to see some kick ass derby because #1-3 is just going to be crazy.
oly
Ok so here it is. look at the past seasons who plays oly first hmm Rose ok with that said after nationals oly doesnt practice at all for the most part and about a week before the bout some of them show up so that would be the most part 2 practices before the fist bout.
Now oly really practices about a hour each practice so really they went into the Rose bout with a fresh line up with not very much practice time.. So your comparing a team that has carried pretty much the same line up and practices hard all year round. and oly with some new girls with different skating styles and at that time really have not skated together!! so why dont you all just quit comparing the first bout of the season between oly and rose. oly doesnt not have a B,C or a D team to skate against like most other leagues so they do not have other bouts to deal with, its just them. Know as far as practicing against other teams yes they did some of those lets see with dockyard derby dames, rcrg' throttle rockets and dlf, and jet city. but the man practice bout situations is every sunday they skate against a boys team I believe they are the national champs too but in these practices it is full full contact. but what better way to hone the hitting skills then oh hit a 6"2 250 plus guy or how ever big they are! ( Right G-no evil and Justice )
So in closing really its no wonder that rose kept the points like they were in the first bout of the year and oly knew it would be that way. But Oly does not blow out other teams at all really what is the point if your ahead and you know you are going to win why skate your ass off and have a boring bout with huge point spreads when you can make it more of a interesting bout and not risk hurting any of your skaters or embaress the other team. Why not have a little sportsmanship and relax and keep it a closer game. Plus the oly girls are actually a pretty lazy bunch of girls. So just let it go it will be proven at regoinals again.
Ps keep watching that oly roster! I see some more surprises coming to the derby land.
Actually...
"oly doesnt not have a B,C or a D team to skate against like most other leagues"
They do have a B team. They played Rose City's B team before the Oly v Rocky bout.
D team?
Who has a D-team???
D Team
is skating on d track.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/w
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/b/b4/Sting.ogg
?
Who has a D-team???
just a expression sorry
like rat has
A. the all stars
just say
b. is dlf
c ..is throttle rockets
d the socket wenches
just a expression
oh yeah
"They do have a B team. They played Rose City's B team before the Oly v Rocky bout.
....THATS why i was skating around in a circle pointing at jammers....
yes they do have the drop
yes they do have the drop kicks but its not a full team that the cosas can play against most all the girls on the dropkicks are new skaters (most not all) they dont breack up and have numerous teams and take the best out of those teams for the travel team like most leagues have!
Haha
Haha...you called Oly lazy...thats funny. Sassy would have you doing sprints for that one.
lol
Haha...you called Oly lazy...thats funny. Sassy would have you doing sprints for that one.
yeah i know thats why i dont use my real name on here! she would she still owns my skates lol
Hmmm...
Ok so here it is. look at the past seasons who plays oly first hmm Rose ok with that said after nationals oly doesnt practice at all for the most part and about a week before the bout some of them show up so that would be the most part 2 practices before the fist bout.
If this is true, whose fault was it?
Back when I was in middle school, I'm pretty sure my mom never tried to improve my grades by telling the teacher, "Ignore that first test, he didn't study for that one."
hmmm
interesting.
Oly, Gotham, outrage, point
Oly, Gotham, outrage, point spreads, blah blah blah.
All I have to say is: BAAAYY ARREEEEEEAAAAAA!
Haha
You need to update yer profile pic :)
anything online this weekend?
The bout page says nothing is scheduled, will something be shown?
This weekend's live events
Video & text from Charm City vs Rocky Mountain (Saturday night)
Video & text from Texas vs. Rat City (Sunday afternoon)
Video & text from The Big One tournament (all weekend)
Hopefully text from Texas vs. Oly, pending adequate technology (Saturday night)
They're not showing on the boutpage quite yet because we don't yet have all the embed information we need to build the boutcast nodes, but we are working that right now.
Montreal
will be boutcasting too saturday at 7pm eastern Filles du Roi vs Ontario
Super Sweet
Go Team Super Sweet! I'll be watching!
And Rose City! Tonight!
Plus, Rose City's semi-finals are tonight! Guns N Rollers v Heartless Heathers at 8pm PST!
http://www.rosecityrollers.com/events/upcoming-events/s5s1-live-stream/
The boys are super busy
The boys are super busy updating right now but I'm pretty sure Texas bouts (at least one of them) and Charm v. Rocky should be live.
And DNN is bringing live coverage of the entire Big One tournament starting tomorrow ayem, thanks to Ivanna S. Pankin. San Diego Derby Dolls (who have their highest ranking on DNN ever), ACDG, Bakersfield, Orange County and most importantly, BAAAAYY ARRREEEEAAAAAAAA will be bouting.
what??
[quote=TaeKwonHo]The boys are super busy updating right now but I'm pretty sure Texas bouts (at least one of them) and Charm v. Rocky should be live.
And DNN is bringing live coverage of the entire Big One tournament starting tomorrow ayem, thanks to Ivanna S. Pankin. San Diego Derby Dolls (who have their highest ranking on DNN ever),
Was it Bigget than the Texas/Gotham bout last year????? I thought the whole world saw that.
The Big One!
Never been to Paso Robles, looking forward to the roadie, barring unforeseen madness it should be SDDD and BAD in the final, been looking forward to a rematch ever since the BAD Girls soundly thrashed the Wildfires last summer... payback time...
Go SDDD!!! They don't need no water let the Wildfires burn!!!
BM
and seriously, Miss Ho, gotta update that profile pic... =)
BAAAYY ARREEEEEEAAAAAA!
(Big If) If all goes as seated at The Big One, Bay Area will play San Diego for the championship. Should be an awesome game.
Atlanta/Nashville
Both of these teams are playing Providence in July. That should be a way of gauging one team to another...I wouldn't want to be Providence right now!! OH wait!!! I am Providence right now...Go Providence!!!!!
Watch out Oly!!!
We're coming after you!!! One power ranking spot at a time. See you in...err..23 months!
Georgia w tush
Montreal roller derby
MTL moving up one ranking at a time...
Cause that's how the New Skids like to do it, STEP BY STEP!!!
Wait
I mean see you in 22 months Oly.. and 23 months Gotham!!
MuhahahHAHAHA
Its very nice
to see Montreal moving up the ranking board this year. A spot on the board feels great.
Sacred City down but not out
Sacred City really took their loss to BAD to heart. They've done some pretty significant in-house cleaning. Coach D is back from the good ol' days... so it'll be good to see how they improve. Their upcoming bouts, especially against ACDG, should be telling.
Coach D's going to bring them some complex team strategy, and with talented skaters like SpillHer and Foxy Knoxy returning.. they should be pretty well positioned to earn their spot at Regionals.
Texas won't get back up
Texas is not the team they used to be.
And, to you MR. "there is no" Justice- The Oly v Charm bout was over early. Never in doubt. So because Oly didn't rub their noses in it they are not as good as a team who does? Nice!
And the Rocky Mtn bout was over mid second half, regardless of the score.
And I suppose Oly didn't beat Texas bad enough tonight either? Wha'ever.
Oly works hard when they need to. They just flat STOP their opponents when it counts. Total domination. You'll see.
Oh, and how many games has Gotham played this year? One? Are they trying to protect their streak or something? And who has Oly played? That's right, EVERYONE!
Texas will be fine.
All they need to do is steal...er..."recruit" some more NC players. Do any other TX announcers need wives?
Actual numbers
The Oly v Charm bout was over early. Never in doubt.
With 16 minutes remaining in the (Oly v CCRG) bout, the score was 105-85.
The two highest scoring jams of the bout were: 19-0 by Flo Shizzle (CCRG) and 19-0 by Lady Quebeaum (CCRG). In fact, the third and fourth highest scoring jams were 15-0 by Atomatrix (Oly) and then 12-0 by Dolly Rocket (CCRG).
Yes Oly played better than Charm City, and that's why they led from the beginning and eventually won. But, it's a pretty big leap to claim that the "bout was over early" and that Oly was just being polite, when a single power jam could have tied the game.
I don't have the jam-by-jam numbers from the Gotham bout, but I know it wasn't within 1 jam half way through the second half.
really
wow, that's interesting, considering the score was pretty close for most of the bout. I didn't even play the entire 2nd half and I usually play on one jam off one jam and sometimes more for the last few years on the team as the pivot.
june rankings
I see Rocky Mountain just gave Charm City a "Gotham" style beating, maybe we should make them #2?
we're ranking based on margin of victory, right?
Just 100 words would do or 3
... the answer to which, sometimes, is that we want to get it posted! We could probably write 500 words on our thinking on every team,......
I think it's fair to say that "triangulation" plays a much larger role in our brief comments than it does in our considered ranking, and that's largely because it is by far the easiest to discuss concisely. As Justice pointed out in his elaborate comment, there's always more to it.
We'll strive to provide greater insight into our thinking in the future, but please rest assured that we put a *lot* of serious thought into this, and we have between us arguably more broad-based experience watching the full spectrum of the sport that just about anyone else.
I'm sorry?
I'm wrong?
Oly #1!
lol
Great bout tonight seeing some new faces for OLY take on the #1 in the South and dominate.
So Rocky Mountain should be #1 now I guess for DNN. And move Oly to #3? I mean it wouldn't surprise me. Or since Oly beat Rocky by more than Rose shouldn't Rose be above Rocky and now Gotham? Ooh I am so confused. Glad we have DNN to do this for me. (satire, all in good fun)
The west is the best, 'nuff said. And Oly is bringing it to Nationals.
Also way to go Wenches tonight! And GD for a great season. And congrats to Rat for bringing Roller Derby to the Key Arena and the mainstream sports media. And let Texas feel the wrath of the PNW Bermuda Triangle. 0-2 Texas, sorry but thats how it goes if your not from the West.
lol yes. The DNN rankings
lol yes. The DNN rankings will now all be decided based on who we lose to and by how many points.
Or they'll say that the rocky game was an anomaly and that it doesn't count.
Of course!
It's because you were strategically down key players since this wasn't for rankings. Amiright?!
Great game on all sides ladies. I was cheering for Charm, but enjoyed watching RMRG too. Nice to see some of the new CCRG All-Stars kicking booty.
No
This counts for rankings. We played to win and lost decisively. A win or a loss shouldn't be based on missing one or two players.
I really wish Oly would've
I really wish Oly would've brought it to a hangover bout in Boston against Gotham, it's sad it didn't fit into their schedule. Why aren't these two teams playing each other when Gotham travels to the West Coast this summer? As a fan of roller derby I don't want to have to wait until the national tournament to see these two teams possibly play.
I really wish I didn't have a computer
Because I am just feeding this machine. Every fan wants to see A vs B. And right now DNN is loving the hits on the website that the Power Ranking give them. ESPECIALLY with the #1 controversy.
But could you imagine if we were still doing National rankings and not regional. Holy Shit! Couldn't imagine what the thread would look like then.
OK this is speaking honestly here. Gotham, Oly, Rocky Mt, Denver, Rose, Rat, Windy, Philly, Texas, Mad, Charm.....(you get my drift) will take on anyone, anytime. But we have to remember as fans no one gets paid here. But thank you DNN for giving Roller Derby the venue to shine. And when the $$$ starts coming in, hopefully some of it will go to the athletes that provide us with this amazing sport.
I must say I love you girls for giving everything you have on the track. Ok back to watching Gotham vs Charm again. LOL
PS- ooh by the way I told Sassy(Oly) today that they are dropping to #5, I mean its obvious right? Rocky Mt beat Charm by way more so July rankings should look like this
#1 Gotham (of course)
#2 Rocky (honestly this is where they should be, they are bad ass, and OLY vs Rocky was the most athletic game ever)
#3 Denver(they beat Duke by more than Rocky and beat Rocky at Nationals*confused but it sounds good*)
#4 Rose (I mean they almost beat Oly right, and Charm by more?)
#5 Oly (undefeated, but honestly what does that really say? I mean they only have beaten most of the DNNs Top 10)
ok I just made my bed here, and Sassy is going to kick my ass. OR hopefully laughs her ass off.
Ugh
I decided to look at Gotham's schedule to see when they're going to give us more data points to debate over.
6/25 - vs (#9) Windy City
6/26 - vs (#13) Boston
7/18 - vs (#10) Madison
8/13 - vs (#21) Bay Area
8/14 - vs (#6) Rat City
8/15 - vs (#5) Rose City
9/24 - Regionals
My guess is that it won't be until Rat and Rose that we get triangulation points that carry more weight than the Charm City bout... which means we're going to be having this argument all summer long (this is where the 'Ugh' comes in).
Of course, if Windy, Boston, Madison or B.A.D. want to give us an exciting upset (or four!) over Gotham, I'm all for that!
Oly vs Gotham
Yeah I want to see that! And who is to say they will even play each other at Nationals, crazy things happen at that tournament you know. They need to book that bout and get it on and give the fans what they want to see!!!!!!! Or are they both to scared to do it because they risk the chance, whoever losses, of losing their reps as being unbeatable etc....
I don't think Oly will go to Gotham nor will Gotham go to Oly...
Gotham was ready for the risk
Gotham was ready to throw down for the overhang bout the day after Oly's bout with Boston, however, some of the Oly's had responsibilities they had to get back to. That being said, I would give both the benefit of the doubt for now as having scheduling issues--plus those east coast/west coast flights and hotels can be pricy for some teams on top of the overhead of keeping the league afloat.
k
k
Minor correction
Big Tom said: "Or are they both to scared to do it because they risk the chance, whoever losses, of losing their reps as being unbeatable etc...."
Gotham doesn't have the rep of being unbeatable.
ranking by point spread
just don't do it, period. this encourages team to run up the score, it rewards offense and penalizes defense, and... its stupid, there, I said it.
On the point spreads.
just don't do it, period. this encourages team to run up the score, it rewards offense and penalizes defense, and... its stupid, there, I said it.
A strong defense can make for a big point spread just as well as a formidable offense.
To be perfectly honest, one skater has far more influence on the point spread than the travel team's jammers, blockers and pivots. Their position is called "Interleague Rep." If you don't like big ugly point spreads, choose an interleague rep who has a good grip on which team is capable of what.
Keep in mind that this person also has to make your schedule work with the teams she wants to bout against. And also that crazy things can happen mid-season. Pregnancy epidemics, layoffs, skater gets a job in another city, injuries, league splits, and so on.
Agree with you.
Although I wouldn't say it necessarily penalizes defense because to me it seems to just encourage as big of a point spread as possible and having a solid D is part of creating that. I hate feeling like you have to run up the score in a game because your score will be compared to others.
Obviously everyone's opinion of what running up the score looks like is different. I know that after playing some games where we were ahead by 50ish points at the half and then almost losing that it's hard to feel comfortable until the point spread is pretty significant. But I have seen others on here say that when someone was beat by 20-30 points that it was a solid win which I think really depends on the game and you can't tell unless you were actually watching it.
Point Spread vs Team Strategy
I agree. From my perspective, running up the score seems rather unsportsmanlike.
By the half, if one team is so obviously dominating... it would make more long-term strategic sense for that team to let the girls who don't get too much game time to, well, get game time (or "test out" new strategies). This helps you develop a deeper bench, which can then help out with managing "pregnancy epidemics" and other risks. (Don't put all your eggs in one basket - there is no i in team - etc).
By doing this, I would imagine the point spread would be lessened... but that isn't indicative of how bad the team is, so much as... how smart they are to use the time they have to build better players.
Having said that, if the players they sub in keep the large point differential then, well, that's just \m/
~rzr
14 player roster
Sorry, but the problem is the 14 player limit. There is no bench. Everyone is already playing. You can play your top players less and your "bench" players more but in reality, if you have 4-5 jammers, that only leaves 9-10 blockers and two packs are 8 blockers already. There's only so much you can do and I vehemently oppose not playing at 100%. That gets people hurt, it's bad for the fans, and the team doesn't get anything accomplished for future games.
I think expanding the number of rostered skaters to 16-18 would do wonders for blowout point spreads and ultimately help the level of play overall because more skaters would get on the track. Or, maybe it could be like soccer where three substitutions are allowed per game or something. Maybe there are unforeseen horrible consequences that other people can point out but I don't really see much of any.
I also think more responsibility could be shown by coaches/captains in deciding what players get in the 14-player roster. I've seen a few games where it was 100-300 point blowout and every player on the winning team had been on the all-star team for 2-3 years and were all definitely the best players on the team. It doesn't take much research to know if you're going to blowout a team by 200 points and there's no reason experienced players need the playing time.
increasing the bench size
I think expanding the number of rostered skaters to 16-18 would do wonders
Do you think this would result in stronger home team advantages, though, since some teams may not have the funds to send that many skaters to away bouts? So theoretically you could suit 16 or 18, but you may not have that many skaters able to make the trip?
RE: increasing the bench size
Good points thebigchuckbowski -- I totally agree. However, I'm still amazed at how many teams still play their "rockstars" while at less then 100%. It blows my mind every time I see it, for the same reasons you've described...
@ KendraBlood -- I'm not sure. Given the teams I've been on, we've always had "extras" show up for matches even though they weren't rostered. A lot of it is for team support, sure, but the "expense" of having them there is covered. If they actually were viable for game time -- all the better. Either way, they're going anyway. I can't speak for all teams though. Would be something nice to bring up to a larger WFTDA vote, though.. . .
~rzr
bigger rosters for busy weekends
It might be a good idea for the WFTDA to make exceptions for teams that play two or three bouts over a weekend to allow an expansion of the bench roster by two skaters-with the increased likely hood of injury as well as mental and physical fatigue, it might be helpful to a team in maintaining optimum performance to carry a few extra bodies to share the bruises.
Already implemented, in essence
WFTDA Chartered teams (the one team from each league eligible to participate in Sanctioned, WFTDA-rankable bouts) may have up to 20 skaters on their charter. The 14-skater limit applies only to an individual game roster, so a team making a three-bout sweep could (say) sit almost every skater on their charter for one of those three bouts, while still fielding a 14-skater roster.
These parameters evolved gradually from more strict limitations, for all the reasons you indicated. In 2006, 14 skaters was the limit, period. The 2.1 ruleset allowed teams to bring up to 20 skaters to a tournament, but placed limitations on subs from one bout to the next: if you were on the 14-skater roster for the first bout of a tournament, but were replaced by someone else in the second bout, you were not eligible to return in later bouts if your team advanced. I believe the current charter system debuted right around the release of the 3.0 ruleset.
RE: Already implemented, in essence
@ Hurt --
True enough, but that still doesn't solve the problem within a specific game. Ahead of time, coaching/inter-league could've seeded a "stacked" roster just to be on the safe side. Then, at the half, they make adjustments to accommodate what's going on on the track - that game. I'm with the previous poster in leaning towards a 16 person roster. At least then you have 3 lines to "play" with. As opposed to 2 lines + a 4 jammer rotation. Subbing in the two remaining skaters wouldn't make that much of a difference..
In some sense, what I'm referring to is ice hockey's, "checking line". As Wikipedia says -- "This line is often played against an opponent's first or second lines in an effort to reduce their scoring, and physically wear them down."
Right derby just has primary and secondary scoring lines... . . .
~rzr
Wha'ever, nerds.
We played to win. The only thing you can do in a game is your best at that moment. We didn't quit when the spread started to uh, spread. And most importantly, we had a blast and so did all the folks at the Bladium watching (can't speak to those who watched via DNN, as I can't see them screaming or yawning when I'm skating around in a circle).
Rocky Mountain is A-MAZING!!!! They earned that blowout. :)
Thanks, DNN, for covering!
That was supposed to be a reply to Gscot.
Need a nap.
Here are photos
http://www.flickr.com/photos/rmrgphoto/sets/72157624093238559/
Charm went for it, never gave up and have a new fan.
DG
Let's be clear....
While I truly enjoy the power rankings system, in the grand scheme of things, they don't mean a thing. The only true was to rank is through tournaments. With the divisional split & newer teams coming along every day, the only way to determine if you are better than another team is to play them. I love that! Our sport is growing & becoming more like the NFL every day....I have seen some amazing bouts this year already & we are not even 1/2 way through it. This should be a very interesting season that begins all over again once we start the regionals.... I put it on the line & say the #1 team in the country is the team with the hydra. The day after it is won, everything is erased & we begin again....
Thats clear to me
I couldn't agree more
Power rankings fuel discussion - everyone wins
First, I have to say from what I've seen, read, and have heard, the rankings strike me as awefully well thought out. I can't say I could definitely argue against any of them.
Sometimes - OK, a lot of the time - we are a sub-culture that doesn't relate to being a sports fan. If people are honest, there are very few that religously follow any one sport or team in every level of participation in our sport. It leaves a HUGE HOLE OF KNOWLEDGE in our sport. How sports are run, coached, tournaments are bracketed (don't get me started), tailored toward the fan (not the player), and that rankings are the most beautiful form of free marketing sports has ever created. Why do you think thousands of radio stations do nothing but argue their points EVERY FREAKIN' DAY?
Norb and I know that on Sunday in Wisconsin, every store in town and major roadway is empty when the Packers take the field. OK, yes, I'll take the "well what the hell else is there to do during a Wisconsin winter?" cracks. But WE LIVE for it. Then we spend the entire week talking about it. It's part of our lives, though I'm guessing Norb is no more adept at catching a 50 yard bomb than I am. Uh, he and I may have past our athletic prime as it comes to running a long route that fast! Actually, with any speed whatsoever.
It seems as if the power rankings have done their job - sparked intense conversation over the sport we love. And, as they continue and you expect them, you will find just as Al says - they're really enjoyable and thought out with much more clarity than college rankings (which blow) - but in the end, it's all stimulation for "what if?" and fun to debate. The proof in the pudding (you can't have any pudding if you don't eat your meat!) are the matchups themselves. But the anticipation and discussion leading up to them, thanks to power rankings and fan/skater hype, makes it that much more thrilling.
Yep
Regions split into divisions with more mandatory divisional/regional games. still a few slots on your schedule to play a team outside your region, but 70% of the schedule within your region.
Bubble Teams
I couldn't help but notice that 5 of the 6 bubble teams listed in the article are from the NC region. Nice!
Re: Bubble Teams
Actually, No Coast is in SC, not NC, even though nearby Omaha is in NC. Sometimes the WFTDA regions are kinda funny. Still, 4 outta 6 ain't bad either.
NC, SC - we're all family
Ah crap, I always try to claim No Coast as one of ours.
"Southern" No Coast
It bemuses me that if I drive to South Central regionals, I'll be driving northeast.
That makes perfect sense,
That makes perfect sense, because when i walk to North Central regionals, i'll be walking southwest.
RANKING THE MENS TEAMS
IS THERE ANY CHANCE THEY WILL DO A RANKING OF THE MEN'S TEAMS ??????
Yikes
To answer your question, the answer is "Maybe someday, but not yet." I already got enough conflicts of interests as it stands :)
As we said way back on the very first Power Rankings thread, we'll probably revisit this after there is an undisputed national champion. How exactly we get to that point remains unclear right now, but with stuff like the Spring Roll tournament and the Men's Derby Coalition regular season happening this year, we're considerably closer to that than we were a year ago.
AHHHHHHHHHAHAHAHAHAHHA!
This CAPS LOCK picture made me laugh so hard!!!!
ain't this great?
A whole page of cussing and discussing derby power rankings? What a bunch of derby dorks! Yay! I love it! Thank you girls. Thank you DNN-
upsets!
Already three upsets involving power ranked teams this month, I can't even wait for next months rankings.
Arch Rivals v. Duke
Bay Area v. San Diego
Philly v. Denver
Here's two more power rankings upsets.
Already three upsets involving power ranked teams this month, I can't even wait for next months rankings.
Arch Rivals v. Duke
Bay Area v. San Diego
Philly v. Denver
Detroit over Madison
Cincinnati over Atlanta
Pretty closely-ranked teams, of course.
one more
Charm over Texas
The July rankings are going to be interesting...
Jet City
And lets not forget about Jet City beating Arch Rival as well, and today Tucson.
I still think this is funny
Oly has no losses. But yet it says 7-2 for 2010. dnn fail..
Also Rocky Mt beat Boston by more than Gotham, Philly beat Denver, Oly Beat Philly, Oly beat Rocky, agh fo'getboutit' Oly beat everyone.
Nice run and gun Gotham this weekend at ECE! but I did see some boring stop wall play too. lol
Oly #1 in the World! *snicker*
Rocky didn't play Boston
This year. Just sayin.
Your right.
This year. Just sayin.
I meant to say Denver.
True
Oly played Boston, 125-60 Oly, and tonight 166-82 Gotham over Boston. But that doesn't mean I don't think Oly's not number one. Gotham has one speed, flat out. Whereas Oly has gears, and it's not going to use it's top gear unless it has too. Which, of course, makes it near impossible to rank Oly correctly, because you only see what they can do in flashes.
finally someone gets the oly
finally someone gets the oly play! right on southbay
G.no-evil lets talk
You know i just wanted to talk about those 2 new adds on the roster, oly has (with out names) i just think its going to be great heard one was one of the highest scoring jammers on her team she retired from at the wildwest show down and the other played great in the line with the oly girls at the fathers day practice between you guys and oly.!! i cant wait for the names to role out and everyone see the strong adds. those girls are taking it seriously they have joined in on a local speed team where they live to work on form and speed i just think they are a great and suprising add for all the derby fans and it will be fun to see faces of people when these 2 come out in the brown!!. I know everyone is going to say oly recriuts skaters but this is so not true i mean really what kind of bennifits do you get with oly.
1. you have to pay for everything yourself including air and hotel.
2. oly doesnt have a great big fan base so its not that.
3. they skate in a rink that is falling apart .
4. wait i got it they get a free pair of atom wheels and get to train with top trainers and skaters in the world. i mean really.
5. coachs for oly maybe' i mean they all trained at the olympics training center
so what do you think
So what you're saying about Oly is...
that one of their highest scoring jammers has retired? And that they have added 2 more speed skating ringers?
no one has retired from oly!
no one has retired from oly! did that come out wrong sorry nope im thinking they might have a couple new girls joining that are great adds to the league that have retired from another league somewhere in the west coast area. and one of those girls i heard was one of the highest scoring jammers on her old league at the wild west show down
I heard that Oly has
I heard that Oly has recruited Lebron James in drag. And apparently, he can plow stop like nobody's business.
No one wants that ego.....
But it would be funny to see him in drag. But Kobe would be the better pick, he knows how to win. lol
mmms the word...
Man that was a hell of a bout too. The roster only seems to get stronger this summer, so as other leagues warm up for regionals and hopefully nationals, Oly is fine tuning. About the open door to the rag tag rink, it seems it has always been open to athletes that want to come in and have fun(while they get whooped into shape).
I know I am personally getting better being around Qualified Olympic Trainers and world class athletes, they make it fun! So even though as Puget Sound Outcast we getting are butts whooped. lol I am pretty sure we are making it harder on them every time to do this, but then again I maybe delusional.
So how many wins is that in a row?
#13
PSOD
"newly added" members of the MDC!
i lost count
I don't remember how many wins in a row 8,10 umm wait I think its like 19 and they are sceduling more as we speak for august and sept. Wich makes me wonder I never see teams like gothem schedule that many bouts? Hmm
Makes me wonder! I don't think I have seen any teams travel team schedule that many games in a season. But its probably just a fluke they must just be machines or just maybe professional skaters I don't know?
But its cool all these other big name players in the derby world are requesting tranfers to oly and with all the fine tunning and playing they are getting before regionals and national the team is just getting stronger and stronger.
It will be and is always fun to watch you all practice with the girls cause no one holds back it is full contact and its great. They were practicing a new trapping play last night I'm sure you will see it this weekend g.no lol.
But I do think we are looking at just a fluke you know. Oly can't be that good
Wait oly #1
It just might have something
It just might have something to do with the fact that Oly pretty much has their own rink, while Gotham plays in a school gym, and NYC has exactly one roller rink for the entire city. And I bet the cost of keeping a practice space in NYC is high enough to impact the money available for a travel budget. There's really only one team within easy travel distance that would have been worth playing that they haven't played yet.
Maybe you don't know how to count?
Oly has a total of 19 bouts for their league's HISTORY. By my count, they have played a total of 8 sanctioned bouts in the 2010 season - not 19. Many other leagues have scheduled similar amounts of bouts in one season, and some have scheduled many more (for instance: Boston, Montreal, & Charm City). Gotham really isn't that far behind in their scheduling in terms of numbers of bouts they will have played by the close of the 2010 season - they just haven't front-loaded them the same way Oly has.
I was talking about since
I was talking about since they became wftda not the 2010 season but thanks
A new trap...f*k
I am still trying not to get pinched in the apex. I see it coming everytime and can get away from it. Its like right tackle coming to get you in football with the trap play. Damn!
Oh well this sunday should be good. New jammers, new faces, maybe someone will record our butts getting whopped again.lol
And those ranking below....hmm I think Philly is rocking right now and should move up. And Texas should move down one more below Windy. At least they have the Oly #1 right. That is sweet.
def not the only ones!
Montreal has been WFTDA since Jan 2009...
http://flattrackstats.com/index.php?nav=teampage&q=MTLRD
check it out, we're like totally tied with Oly! :p
yeah, i'm 12
it will be fun to see faces of people when these 2 come out in the brown!!
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHHAHHAHAAH
HELLARAD
www.wearehellarad.com
Oh, HELLARAD
Oh, HELLARAD....
You do not know me, but I drink great quantities of (very good) alcohol in your honor. To the finest publication this side of GRIT Magazine!
athleticism + humor = super sexy
you will always be 19-0 (or more) in our hearts.
xoxo
really
it's the 5th. WE WANT RANKINGS!
:)
From the FAQ:
When will DNN Power Rankings be posted?
We'll endeavor to post updated rankings in the first week of each month.
(After the last three nonstop months, we're fried... the US holiday weekend with no rankings-impinging bouts gave us a much-needed respite. Not long now.)
Let the speculation begin
What do you think DNN's Top 25 for July will be? Here's my guess.
1 Gotham
2 Oly
3 Rocky Mountain
4 Philly
5 Denver
6 Rose City
7 Boston
8 Windy City
9 Rat City
10 Charm City
11 Texas
12 Detroit
13 Madison
14 Bay Area
15 San Diego
16 Steel City
17 London
18 Cincinnati
19 Kansas City
20 North Star
21 Atlanta
22 Dallas
23 Montreal
24 Nashville
25 Jet City
montreal...
I can't claim to know much, but I textcasted both Montreal bouts and a half of a North Star bout last weekend and I would put Montreal above North Star without a doubt. There's also the fact that Montreal beat Carolina (at Carolina) by 100+ back in mid-April and North Star and Carolina played each other at ECE and North Star took it by 29 points and from what I remember it was a 1 point game at halftime.
Your Killin me
Im dying for the July Rankings. I wake up every morning turn on my laptop and get disappointed.
JULY RANKINGS!!!!!
After what I saw at ECDX, I can not wait to see what the ranking will be. Not to mention, June being an amazing month for derby. Charm beats Texas!! Montreal beats everyone!! Oly still unbeaten!!!! What could happen???? I need my fix!!
Same here
Though it will likely see my home league drop out of the top 25 after losing to Northstar at ECDX. They came in down their #2 jammer, and 3 starting blockers. They have the talent to replace them, but integrating new players always takes time, especially several at once.
July Top 10
I'm not going to speculate on DNN's power rankings since after watching Gotham at ECE and Oly vs TXRG I'm convinced Oly is a stronger team. So here are my picks for top 10 for July:
1. Oly
2. Gotham
3. Rocky Mountain
4. Rose City
5. Philly
6. Denver
7. Rat City
8. Charm City
9. Texas
10. Windy City
Post them already d@mn it!
So I can get my email to Hurt about "how it was not right to drop Brewcity out of the Rankings for losing two ambitiously scheduled games" ready to go!
Damn the Bubble! It's gonna get brought in the next couple of months.
*twiddles thumbs*
Okay, so they are still be worked on. Back to work for me.
First.
Even though the new rankings haven't been posted yet, let me be the first to say...
IT'S AN OUTRAGE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!