Derby News Network Power Rankings - September 2009
| DNN | WFTDA | W/L | Next | Notes | ||||
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
|
|
1 E | 2009 4-0 2008 10-0 |
9/11 @ Providence | No action or movement since last month. They haven't lost a bout since September 2007 and will take on #25 Providence in their first bout at Eastern Regionals. | ||||
|
1 SC | 2009 5-1 2008 10-4 |
9/6 vs Bay Area | No action or movement since last month. They'll be up against a quickly improving Bay Area team at home in their last tune-up before their South Central tournament. | ||||
|
2 E | 2009 6-1 2008 10-4 |
9/11 @ Steel City | An atypical Philly roster was whipped 149-74 by #7 Charm City last month, but it's hard to draw much of a prediction from that as Philly will undoubtedly bring all their weapons to the party at Eastern Regionals. No movement for Philly, holding steady at #3. | ||||
|
|
1 NC | 2009 6-1 2008 12-4 |
9/18 @ Minnesota | Had their way with #7 Charm City for almost their whole bout, up by 52 points in the second half before having to fight off one of Charm's signature late runs; WCR held on to win by 19. They keep their Power Ranking and remain the top seed in their North Central region. | ||||
|
1W | 2009 6-0 2008 6-2 |
10/2 @ Duke City | Practically used a bout with over-matched #23 Angel City as a speed clinic last month, putting up a 233-47 win. They'll be idle as an all-star team until Western Regionals start in October, though. | ||||
|
2 W | 2009 6-1 2008 4-8 |
9/19 @ Sacred City | The Mile High Club got a good taste of what they can expect at Westerns, and passed the test when they used a late-game surge to turn a nailbiter into a romp, 188-135 over #9 Rat City. They've remained neck and neck with Oly ever since the 170-168 Oly win back in April. | ||||
|
|
3 E | 2009 12-3 2008 9-2 |
9/11 @ DC | Charm City remains bedeviled by the slow start -- against Windy City, they didn't get on the board until they were down 28-0, and eventually were behind by their biggest margin all year in 52 points, but managed to erase 39 points of it before running out of time and losing 117-98. | ||||
|
|
3 W | 2009 4-1 2008 6-4 |
10/2 @ Rocky Mountain | The Portland girls scored two wins in August -- they delivered a blowout win over visiting #15 Duke City 154-69 and traveled to defeat #12 Bay Area after a tough fight 138-120, extending their winning streak to 4 in a row. | ||||
|
4 W | 2009 4-5 2008 3-3 |
10/2 @ Bay Area | Late-game troubles continue to plague Rat City, as they couldn't hang on to second-half leads twice in August -- losing 122-94 to Windy City at home, and 188-135 to Denver away. | ||||
|
2 NC | 2009 5-3 2008 8-3 |
9/18 @ Burning River | Detroit holds steady after a tense back-and-forth struggle with #11 Boston, and their #2 seed in the North Central seems to give them a very good shot at reaching Nationals. | ||||
|
5 E | 2009 6-7 2008 9-2 |
9/11 @ Carolina | Boston couldn't quite pull it out against Detroit, but they're headed for an epic Day 1 confrontation with #13 Carolina at Eastern Regionals. Carolina prevailed by a single point last time they met -- with a shot at Nationals on the line, this looks like a stellar regionals matchup. | ||||
|
5 W | 2009 3-3 2008 13-3 |
9/6 @ Texas | Popping back up after a momentary dive: following their big July loss to Boston that sank them in the rankings, they impress twice in August with a close one against #8 Rose City (138-120) and a big win over San Diego, 140-67. Their bout with Texas is the last big one before tournaments start, and should provide some insight on whether they have the firepower to finish top-3 in a very tough Westerns in October and return to Nationals. | ||||
|
4 E | 2009 2-6 2008 7-5 |
9/11 vs Boston | Though they didn't play in August, Carolina loses a space to Bay Area based on their recent bouts against Rose City -- Bay Area was in the game very late before losing to Rose 138-120, while Carolina was knocked out of their own game against Rose City fairly early, losing 120-62. | ||||
|
2 SC | 2009 5-2 2008 5-2 |
9/12 @ Duke City | Didn't have much trouble with Houston in a 145-76 bout in August, but the Roller Warriors slip a spot on Bay Area jumping back up the rankings. | ||||
|
6 W | 2009 4-5 2008 6-3 |
9/12 @ Kansas City | A 154-69 walloping at the hands of #8 Rose City suggests that Duke might have a particularly tough time at Westerns, but Duke stays at #15 with the help of San Diego dropping two. They do get one more shot to impress before their tournament when they take on Kansas City in one of the biggest rematches of the year. | ||||
|
- | 2009 8-2 2008 5-7 |
10/17 vs Cincinnati | A very successful 2009 thus far hit a major pothole when they met up with Bay Area in an unofficial battle for California flat-track dominance and got dismissed by a final of 140-67. San Diego will be quiet through September before taking on Cincinnati in a unique hybrid weekend in October -- one bout flat, one bout banked. | ||||
|
|
8 W | 2009 2-4 2008 12-4 |
10/2 @ Tucson | No action or movement since last month. High-profile transfers Psycho Babble, DeRanged, and Ecko Girl, all from Pikes Peak, may boost Rocky Mountain's tournament prospects. | ||||
|
7 W | 2009 5-3 2008 10-3 |
9/19 @ Boston | No action or movement since last month. Rocky Mountain's gain is Pikes' loss -- the Colorado Springs team may have an uphill climb replacing those key contributors. | ||||
|
3 NC | 2009 5-1 2008 9-7 |
9/18 @ Brewcity | Thumped the up-and-coming North Star by a solid 142-55. While they extend their winning streak to 4 on the year with that, they still have yet to notch a solid upset to move up the rankings -- but they've got a good chance at reaching Nationals with a #3 in the North Central seed. | ||||
|
5 NC | 2009 5-4 2008 5-2 |
9/6 vs Cincinnati | A big win over unranked Fort Wayne, but Madison still functions as the ceiling for Arch Rival after ARRG's 35 point loss to the Dairyland Dolls in late July. Expect an intense clash at North Central regionals -- Arch Rival faces Cincinnati to close out the first day, with only the victor remaining in the hunt for Nationals. | ||||
|
3 SC | 2009 4-1 2008 4-10 |
9/25 @ No Coast | Ticks up a slot with a 103-76 win over #24 Minnesota. Houston holds the strong 3 seed in the South Central tournament, and will most likely have to defeat Atlanta or Dallas for a trip to Nationals. | ||||
|
4 NC | 2009 7-2 2008 12-7 |
9/6 @ Arch Rivals | Cincy trades spots with Houston, as Cincinnati claimed a 21 point win over tough but unranked Steel City. To get out of North Centrals with a trip to Nationals, Cincy will have to take out tough Arch Rival and then drop a major upset on either Detroit or Madison. |
||||
|
10 W | 2009 7-3 2008 8-6 |
10/2 @ Pikes Peak | The LA girls were completely dominated by #5 Oly in a major rankings mismatch, 233-47. #18 Pikes Peak will be their first opponent at Western Regionals in October. | ||||
|
6 NC | 2009 3-1 2008 7-7 |
9/18 vs Windy City | Performed about to ranking expectations with a 27 point loss to then-#22 Houston in August. However, Minnesota drew the unfavorable #6 seed into North Central Regionals and will have to go up against the tournament's top seed, Windy City. | ||||
|
6 E | 2009 4-2 2008 2-7 |
9/11 @ Gotham Girls | Holding steady at #25 after a big but expected 149-69 loss to #10 Detroit, Providence gets arguably the toughest draw in the whole tournament cycle when they have to meet #1 Gotham in their very first bout at Easterns. | ||||
| Key: | |
| E | WFTDA East region |
| W | WFTDA West region |
| NC | WFTDA North Central region |
| SC | WFTDA South Central region |
Comments
Nice analysis, as usual
As we saw, Bay Area wasn't able to defeat Texas, but they made it an awfully close bout, showing that they'll be no pushovers at regionals. Westerns are the one tournament where I would not care to try predicting the final outcome, which is why I'm so thrilled to be there in person.
Minor correction, Angel City's and Rocky Mountain's next bouts will be at Westerns.
thanks Brad...
As we saw, Bay Area wasn't able to defeat Texas, but they made it an awfully close bout, showing that they'll be no pushovers at regionals. Westerns are the one tournament where I would not care to try predicting the final outcome, which is why I'm so thrilled to be there in person.
Minor correction, Angel City's and Rocky Mountain's next bouts will be at Westerns.
Losing star players, or say half your starting team, can make it hard to pull those big scores - we took a rankings dive, but we tried to focus on the game play, and getting our new starters up to speed.
I am SO proud of our Bay Area team, and to all the girls who are new to the travel team. We lost to Texas, but it still felt like a win. Western Regionals will be insane. that is my only prediction!!
WHAT??? IT'S AN OUTRAGE, I
WHAT??? IT'S AN OUTRAGE, I TELL YOU!!!
Someday i will tell my metaphorical grandchildren that i actually saw the time the Gotham Girls lost.
The team you bring to the track is your team
While DNN has stated before in these comments that they don't base rankings on a team playing without their star jammer or certain vets, time and time again I see this stated anyway. This month in the Philly lowdown. Any team who plans for long-term success probably isn't playing the same 14 every game. Turnover, retirements and injuries happen. Sometimes a skater finds she can't afford to travel that week or can't get off of work. A team that isn't developing a full 20 (and deeper) is likely to fall in rankings quickly if or when their 1 or 2 names are gone. No team should fall apart if 1 or 2 quit. I urge teams not to let themselves be held hostage like this. Someday I'd like to see a prediction of rankings and success long-term based on development systems.
like
While DNN has stated before in these comments that they don't base rankings on a team playing without their star jammer or certain vets, time and time again I see this stated anyway. This month in the Philly lowdown. Any team who plans for long-term success probably isn't playing the same 14 every game. Turnover, retirements and injuries happen. Sometimes a skater finds she can't afford to travel that week or can't get off of work. A team that isn't developing a full 20 (and deeper) is likely to fall in rankings quickly if or when their 1 or 2 names are gone. No team should fall apart if 1 or 2 quit. I urge teams not to let themselves be held hostage like this. Someday I'd like to see a prediction of rankings and success long-term based on development systems.
I wish there was a "like" button for this :D
I agree... mostly
I completely agree with your main point. The biggest improvement I've seen in my league over last year is greater depth, to where one or two of the all-stars can miss a bout for whatever reason and they'll still be able to compete at a national level. A retirement isn't "Oh no, what'll we do," it's "Ah, another promising skater gets a chance."
At the same time, I see completely where DNN is coming from when they choose to discount Philly's loss to Charm when they sat not one, not two, but six of their top players -- it's because they believe that if those two teams met today (or, y'know, this coming weekend...), Philly would win. And that's what these ranks boil down to.
if they met
you know, like 2 weeks ago
Rosters aside
There's another factor in this specific ranking scenario, that being the Charm City - Windy City game.
In the last six weeks:
Philly beat Windy City 70-69 (and Philly led for nearly that entire game)
Charm beat the atypical Philly roster 149-74
Windy City beat Charm 117-98 (and Windy City led for the whole game, often by a lot)
It is impossible to rank these three teams relative to each other without somebody being ranked lower than a team they recently defeated.
If you think Philly should have fallen below Charm City for losing to them, then you're stuck with a different logic problem (why should Philly be below Windy City?) The only way to justify that is to say that winning by one point doesn't really count, which sounds like a flame war waiting to happen :p
I see what you are saying,
I see what you are saying, and maybe you had to say that it was an atypical team to defend your rankings. But this isn't the first time it's been stated that a strong team was missing a few "key" folks (please hold....I will go back and quote in a bit) even tho when someone asked about whether that gets taken into rankings (I think it was) Hurt who said no in a comment earlier this summer (again, will try to find the quote).
In the past year (since just before Fall Brawl II), we've changed charters multiple times and I think ARRG has seen something like 25 different folks get playtime this year. Yet, we have remained competitive. So if you were placing all your bets on beating us by shutting down a certain key jammer, joke's on you :)
How to look at that bout.
This sort of thing happens before every tournament season.
League that's firmly up in the rankings puts a group of skaters that are on their 20 skater chartered roster but are not quite their usual A team. As he mentioned there were 6 usual skaters left off. Let's see, 20-6=14. That suggests to me a purposeful intent to have a different group of skaters play in a bout that was perceived as "not mattering so much."
In other words, those six "subs" would get some high level bouting experience, get some experience working against less-known competition, and experience working with a portion of the "usual suspects." At the tournament the usual 14 go out, the six subs are there and available as needed. As it's a top-rank team, the outcome of the tournament will impact their WFTDA rankings votes far more than that explainable loss to a team they'd probably beat at the tournament.
Let's see, hey, that's actually what happened, hmmm?
And remember how they do the rankings. "Could this team beat that team if they met today?"
A classic conundrum
As a nerdy aside:
The question of how to rank Windy-Charm-Philly this month is a good example of a classic problem that will bedevil any system that attempts to rank-order a set of items based on one-on-one matchups. In any such system, the situation can arise such that A beats B beats C beats A, an endless cycle that cannot be empirically resolved. The problem is known as Condorcet's Paradox, and was first noted (in the context of multi-candidate voting methods) by the Marquis de Condorcet in the 1700s.
For more info, see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Condorcet_paradox
</nerditude>
-Treble Damage
ps - hooray for the shiny new DNN!
:P
NERD!
(Diehard CCRG) Fan's POV
I urge teams not to let themselves be held hostage like this. Someday I'd like to see a prediction of rankings and success long-term based on development systems.
I had a conversation recently with a skater about the whole Philly thing and they felt very strongly that I should post about one Fan's feelings regarding the issue. I wasn't really sure where to put it (hmmm... DNN feature request idea: open forums where users can create new threads about anything), so I'm using this post to jump off from.
When I went to the CCRG v Philly bout I hadn't heard that there were six skaters left off of Philly's lineup. I definitely recognized that there were a couple of key players missing, but I was getting a beer and missed the lineups at the beginning of the bout. Anyway, watching Charm City dominate the entire bout was so exciting (I guess I should have known something was up... they never do that well in the first half!). It wasn't until Monday at work when I was reading DNN that I found out what Philly had done.
I don't want to make it sound like Philly are a bunch of villains, because they aren't. I used to live up there and I know Philly and their fans get enough hate as is. The truth is they made a very strategic decision. Because of the lag between how playoffs seeds are determined and when playoffs occur, there is no incentive for them to bring their best game against a team they are expecting to have to play to earn their trip to Nationals. In fact, it's a sign of a healthy, competitive attitude among the team. Major sports do this thing all the time: once they've secured their spot in playoffs they'll bench their Tom Brady's or their Alex Rodriguez's in order to reduce their chance of injury and give their backup players a greater opportunity to experience top quality competitive play. What Philly did is exactly what Philly should have done.
That doesn't mean that I wasn't incredibly disappointed anyway once I found out. I had been very excited to see my team do so incredibly well, and seeing that the win came against not their A team left me feeling quite a bit ripped off. It was kind of like if I had found out there had been some procedural error and Charm City's win didn't count. Charm City played a great game, but it wasn't the highly anticipated matchup I had been promised at the beginning of the year when the bout had been announced. Furthermore, I was a little upset because I realized that Charm City probably had shown their hand early for Regionals and Philly probably hadn't... and the last thing I want is for Charm City to give an advantage to Philly in Regionals.
I don't know what the solution is. I know that if Charm City had gone to Philly and six of their major players didn't lace up, and that advantage helped them to win at Regionals, I'd be happy. I also know that if I had driven up to Philly to watch that hypothetical bout, and then gotten there and found out that six of their top players weren't playing and then watched Philly trounce Charm City I would have been extremely disappointed.
Derby is still young and definitely has not reached a steady state yet. Strategies like this have their advantages as well as their costs. I wanted to make sure to share one Fan's feelings on the matter, and perhaps generate some discussion. I apologize if this topic hijacks the thread from something other than rankings... but then it wouldn't be the first time. As Joanie implied above, the teams' decisions have a lot of impact on how the sport continues to grow and mature.
P.S. Go Charm City! Good luck this weekend!
I agree with your point. A
I agree with your point. A team should be ranked by what it brings to the track. While it's always unfortunate that ANY team lose players, they are a team, and they showed up to play.
It's not good for a team to be rewarded or protected because they couldn't bring their full roster to play. Durability and availability do count, especially when it affects the W/L count.
That's my 0.02$ (CAD)
Well, right, but...
If a superstar player is injured, unavailable, or quits, it may effect their team negatively for a short amount of time until they get used to playing without them. Their first few months of bouts without that player may not be up to snuff, or they may indeed shine without the superstar and act as a team. Both types of scenarios may be shortlived, or they may be a long-term issue. I trust that DNN takes that into account in [Dumptruck voice]POWER RANKINGS[/Dumptruck voice].
SOLID single-malt. philly
SOLID single-malt.
philly used a strategy when they faced charm in august. and they used a different one when they played in september. regardless of what you think of their strategies...they won when it mattered.
and i bet that worrying about their August DNN power ranking was buried well below their planning and desire to win their region in september.
Wait, huh?
< broken record >
DNN Power Rankings are not based on wins and losses. They are based on who we think would win a meeting tomorrow. They exist only partially to quantify past results; the point of them is to attempt to predict future results.
< / broken record >
In the case of Charm / Philly, Philly's ranking did not change whatsoever after they lost to Charm because we at DNN had good reason to think that 1) the August bout was not indicative of Philly's potential strength, 2) Philly would bring their potential strength to Regionals and 3) Philly's potential strength was greater than Charm City's. Having been with Charm City since the very beginning, I would have liked to have been wrong on that one, but I think Regionals demonstrated we were right.
I think it also backed up our point that rosters DO matter for the purposes of predicting future outcomes. There's a difference between saying "Ideally, a team should be deep and able to overcome the loss of key players" (which is true) and saying "A team is equally likely to win or lose no matter who is on their gametime roster" (which is demonstrably untrue.)
Which was proven
There's a difference between saying "Ideally, a team should be deep and able to overcome the loss of key players" (which is true) and saying "A team is equally likely to win or lose no matter who is on their gametime roster" (which is demonstrably untrue.)
Which was proven at Eastern Regionals and anyone that tries to argue otherwise should be institutionalized.
Even though you're with Charm City, I've got to think you guys were happy with the Philly win so people would stop making this argument.
You guys are nerds.
I love y'all, but you're nerds.
Totally not true!
Even though you're with Charm City, I've got to think you guys were happy with the Philly win so people would stop making this argument.
Not so! I, for one, would have happily traded a month (or more) of being taunted for poor prognostication skills by Joy Collision for a Charm City berth in Nationals.
Alas. Wait till next year...
"In the case of Charm /
"In the case of Charm / Philly, Philly's ranking did not change whatsoever after they lost to Charm because we at DNN had good reason to think that 1) the August bout was not indicative of Philly's potential strength, 2) Philly would bring their potential strength to Regionals and 3) Philly's potential strength was greater than Charm City's. Having been with Charm City since the very beginning, I would have liked to have been wrong on that one, but I think Regionals demonstrated we were right."
Okay, And, I don't like being specific here, but where you say "the August bout was not indicative of Philly's potential strength" I would weigh in and say that the August bout does say something about Philly's team, in that they were not able to field their top plays, no matter what the reason was.
It's like saying the Patriots should have been ranked first in the NFL last year, because Tom Brady was hurt, and they had the potential to be the best team.
Having great players on your team is awesome, but when they miss games and the team loses, then really, how great is the team? I just don't think "woulda, coulda, shoulda's" should factor in as highly. Or rather, that they should count for so much against a team that brought it to the track and won.
I'm sorry
Did they beat Gotham? Yes. Did they beat Charm by 75? Yes. Right now, they're the best team in the county (how can you possibly argue otherwise? Maybe you could make a case for Oly, but that's it). If the 6 players that didn't play against Charm all get hurt, then you can make this argument (Everyone knew Tom Brady was hurt all season, that's why they weren't ranked #1 (even though there aren't rankings in the NFL). If he would've sat out the first game but everyone knew he was coming back and the Pats lost that game, nobody would have changed their ranking of the Pats because everyone would know Tom Brady was coming back. Of course, in this instance, it was more like Tom Brady, Randy Moss, Wes Welker, and Rodney Harrison weren't playing). As it is, they're healthy.
What if Gotham sat out their best 6 players and got beat by Charm by 75 in an essentially meaningless game? Should Gotham suddenly drop to 7th and Charm be ranked #1? One game where their 6 best players aren't playing suddenly erases 18 straight wins? That's ridiculous.
What do you think DNN is trying to rank? The teams with the best back-ups? No. They're trying to rank the best teams and that includes when those teams are playing with their best players.
I completely agree with your
I completely agree with your sentiment, and I think there is little question that Philly should be placed higher than Charm City, but I have to ask: Did you really mean to say that the NFL doesn't have rankings?
By rankings
I mean there is no official or really unofficial body ranking teams that anyone puts any stock into. It's purely win/loss record to compile the standings.
Power/Rankings
Power rankings are not official rankings. They're an opinion. So, in the (well-informed) unofficial opinon of DNN, Philly is a better team than Charm right now.
In most sports, a "W" is a "W" for their official rankings. That's not always the case in WFTDA rankings. Of course in tournaments, a win is a win, and whoever you put on the track is your team.
So, DNN saying Philly was better than Charm is more like a writer for ESPN.com ranking the Patriots over another team with a better record because Tom Brady was supposed to come back from injury that week. The NFL rankings don't change. The sports writers' predictions do.
Word!
totally killer strategy
SOLID single-malt.
philly used a strategy when they faced charm in august. and they used a different one when they played in september. regardless of what you think of their strategies...they won when it mattered.
I agree wholeheartedly. Playing all of your high scoring jammers is a totally killer strategy every team should consider using, especially when it matters. and maybe even when it doesn't!
*Whew*
That loss to BADG had me dreading this month's power rankings, but its not as bad as I thought! And - if I get it... this was figured BEFORE Bay Area had such a powerful showing against Texas. Congratulations BADG! And thanks for kicking us into a higher training gear, too.
However, I do have one teeny tiny respectfully offered dispute with DNN over our comments... San Diego is not actually "quiet" during September... our Swarm team is playing on the banked track this month against one of LA Derby Dolls most successful teams, the Sirens. And we're taking all of WFTDA's tournament season to recalibrate with some other really fun games to develop more players. Nothing is quiet on this western front!
PS the new site looks friggin AWESOME!
Can't Wait
Can't wait to come down and play the Diego Rollers on Sep 26th
Lulu Lockjaw #21
Santa Cruz Derby Girls
lulu.lockjaw@yahoo.com
brilliant!
kudos to DNN!! your coverage continues to amaze and impress! The new look of the website is fantastic and your rankings and annaylsis are brilliant, thorough and precise! way to go DNN TEAM!
$0.02
(I'm new to this, so please forgive me if I'm off the mark.) Feelgood is absolutely clear that Power Rankings are not win-loss records. There's no confusion here; it's informed commentary. If the commentator chooses to ignore or marginalize a particular bout, that's his editorial choice. I, for one, appreciate that the commentary openly states the reasoning. That leaves me informed and free to agree or disagree with the merits of the ranking.
IMHO, depth of bench should be a component of a team's power or potential to win.
However, what I'm not seeing in the comments above is: WHY did Philly not play at full strength? If a full squad was healthy and available and it was a coaching decision, then it's probably appropriate to marginalize the loss in terms of potential. If, on the other hand, it was due to injuries or unavailable skaters, then that does show a weaker bench with less potential.
Of course, that's moot now with the results of the Regional. When do the next Power Rankings go up?
why?
the simplest answer to why we didn't play our "normal" bench was that we wanted to give our every skater on our 20-person charter a chance to get track time before tourney season.
since the game fell 2 weeks before regionals, which would provide an actual game-based rank, it seemed like an opportune time to do so.
that's about it.
Drink Beer Watch Derby
...as my zen master once said.
No need to apologize about your questions, phydeaux. You might be new to this but you are obviously paying attention. I pondered the same question about why Philly didn't play at full strength, grasshopper. Philly's strategy obviously worked.
Power rankings come out when the mavens of DNN digest the results, run them through the supercollider of their shared consciousness and regurgitate them for the assembled masses of Derby fanatics to gnaw on and haggle over. ETA is ...
It's never been a better time to be a derby fan. I remember watching derby on TV in the 70's when I was kneehigh to a grasshopper and thinking, "Something aint right here. What's all this mishegas?"
Modern derby passes the sniff test. So be patient and enjoy the circus. When you get a bit frustrated, click on Music soothes the savage beast
The Philly roster
However, what I'm not seeing in the comments above is: WHY did Philly not play at full strength? If a full squad was healthy and available and it was a coaching decision, then it's probably appropriate to marginalize the loss in terms of potential. If, on the other hand, it was due to injuries or unavailable skaters, then that does show a weaker bench with less potential.
Confirmation, at long last:
http://www.citypaper.net/articles/2009/09/24/philly-roller-girls
confirmation?
However, what I'm not seeing in the comments above is: WHY did Philly not play at full strength? If a full squad was healthy and available and it was a coaching decision, then it's probably appropriate to marginalize the loss in terms of potential. If, on the other hand, it was due to injuries or unavailable skaters, then that does show a weaker bench with less potential.
Confirmation, at long last:
http://www.citypaper.net/articles/2009/09/24/philly-roller-girls
From the article:
"We didn't play six of our All-Stars," she says, in order to keep their "A-game" under wraps for the Eastern Division Championship — where Philly won by more than 100 points.
what game did they win by 100 points? Are you saying that Philly went into that game expecting to lose?
a few errors
When Violet Temper linked the article in Facebook, she did mention that the article got a couple of facts wrong. Seems to be a bit common when non-derby folk write about derby stuff.
it sadly
got almost everything wrong.
I hate
that article....cause the facts are all wrong.
We've played several games this season while missing key players. In April against Carolina we were missing both Persephone and Nina Knockout because they couldn't travel. In April against Boston we were missing Shenita Stretcher due to injury.
And while these changes to the "normal" roster did give some track time to more of our charter roster, many of them hadn't seen track time as a Liberty Belle all season.
Perhaps we just had an "oh shit" moment are we really benefiting the league and team by not expanding our game day roster? Every member of our charter (and the majority of our league) train hard each and every practice and deserve to play and deserve the recognition that a few of us get when we perform well. Its because of their hard work that Philly has done so well this season.
So, we didn't go into that bout in August against Charm City expecting to lose...but losing is healthy and losing is a learning experience. And boosting moral among the team by having everyone skate a game or two - does wonders! I wish we had done it sooner!
tef
Word!
High 5 Tef!
And this is why you have to
And this is why you have to use intimate knowledge of the game and teams in DNN rankings, instead of going by win/loss records and objective stats. The fact that teams may deliberately withhold skaters or run experimental line-ups is something that doesn't show up in parametric stats. But inside knowledge or educated guesses allow you to handicap to compensate.
It does result in a one or two rank fudge factor though. So long as tournaments have a heavier weighting than individual games or non-regional/national tournies, you can expect some manipulation in individual games and secondary tournies like ECE. The sport is still in mid-evolution, and this sort of thing is a side effect of that.
That quote is incorrect. As
That quote is incorrect. As much as PRG might like to pat ourselves on the back for ingenious long-term strategy, the simple fact is exactly as Violet has stated. The Liberty Belle's captains wanted our entire roster to play before tournament season and it was our last chance. Period.
Paul Williams
And this is why you have to new
"It does result in a one or two rank fudge factor though. So long as tournaments have a heavier weighting than individual games or non-regional/national tourneys, you can expect some manipulation in individual games and secondary tourneys like ECE. The sport is still in mid-evolution, and this sort of thing is a side effect of that."
The end result of all that has happened this past year is:
1. That all the derby world (that's paying attention) will learn lessons and benefit from the "plowing" ahead that all the teams are doing to make their way as far as their hard work will reward them.
2. That like most sports there is still not a perfect way to rank and therefore send teams into a playoff situation.
3. That derby is constantly evolving , and any one of us could be the team that creates the next; Left wing lock, forward pass, or just awesome unstoppable, indefensible, strategies.
4. That we should all look back and see just how far we've come to get to this point, to have these spirited, intelligent, feisty discussions.
5. That no matter what an idiot baseball commentator says about derby, we will have all been a part of a huge growing sport that enables women and men of all backgrounds to come together and put all they have into something they never thought would be possible.
6. That Joy Collision equals six of Philly's best players. (check the two bout scores)
7. That going to four divisions too early really doesn't showcase your best teams and players. But is a brave decision none-the-less.
I will stop at seven, point being we (all of Roller Derby) are the ground floor to an ever growing empire. I am proud of the way that our girls here in Charm City played this whole entire year. We showed the rest of the derby world what seasons are going to be like in the future of this sport. There will be alot of games, you will lose players to injury, the economy, their husbands and families. We played a season that should be a model for every team. Play the best teams you can and play the teams in your division.
We had alot of goals this season and I would say that our team accomplished 90% of them. That is the lesson that every team should take from each season: Set your goals and try to accomplish them.
I have played many different sports in my life, but can honestly say that this season taught me the most about myself. Our girls here a just so special, they don't give up, as you will have seen if you've ever seen one of our bouts.
So back to the point. We are watching the best our sport has to offer at this moment, pay attention and use it for the years to come.
Personally I can't wait to see how this all comes out in the end at Nationals. Good luck to you all.
Mister Pistol!!!!
Thank YOU for an awesome season and for saying such powerful and true things. You are a great coach and we think the world of you.
In case people out there in derby land aren't keen on this yet...we here at Charm truly love and care about one another. We are friends, we are family....and we like to have fun. Let's hope that is one thing that "people who are paying attention" have noticed. We love our sport so much and hope that as we grow, our sport retains it's most essential piece to it's soul.....fun.
Oh, and to Mr. Pistol's #6 point. Yeppers, ya better believe it. Joy Collision does equal six Philly skaters. And not by size or stature or speed or talent...but in heart. I can say with full confidence that she is one of the greatest derby players on the scene today. On top of that, Joy Collision is one of the most awesome friends and loving people I have ever met. Believe it. She may be a threat on the track but, she is one of the most righteous people off. And though she may have been taken down temporarily, she's not out. So hang in there folks.
Can anyone say record setting 30 point jam?
And seriously, good luck to everyone at Nationals....can't wait!
Oct power rankings
Man you guys are going to be busy. So many awesome upsets and huge point spreads. I can't wait!
I AM OUTRAGED IN ADVANCE.
I AM OUTRAGED IN ADVANCE.
I object
I disagree with your outrage and have five pages of text to explain why.
i will sit here like this:
http://bit.ly/14Lb3r