West Final: 4W Oly Vanquishes 2W Denver, 168-161
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Photo: Dave Wood. -
Photo: Donalee Eiri. -
Photo: Dave Wood. -
Photo: Dave Wood. -
Photo: Dave Wood. -
Photo: Dave Wood. -
Photo: Dave Wood. -
Photo: Dave Wood.
RICHMOND, CA -- In the final game of the WFTDA West Region Playoffs, 4W Oly overcame a tough Denver team -- and an equally tough crowd -- to win the region for the third time in four years. Denver led Oly with under 15 minutes to go, and the margin was single digits for the last ten minutes, but Oly stayed barely ahead to take the victory, 168-161.
Oly set the pace of the game early -- and it was a very fast pace, a night-and-day difference from Denver's early-tournament games. Oly took first blood in a very quick thirty-second 2-0 to Atomatrix, and the second was equalized as lead jammer On Da Sligh got passed by Sandrine Rangeon in her opening pas and had to settle for 4-4. Oly's lead jammer streak continued as Lindsay Loblow took 2-0 in a very speedy pack.
Denver struck right back with three lead jam calls in a row; on the third, Denver jammer Caitlin Krause put her team in the lead as Vicky Cruz, Susie Long and Krisana Barrett buried Oly jammer Lindsay Loblow. Krause's natural 14-0 put Denver ahead for the first time at 23-11.
Two jams later, Oly called their first timeout at 19:57 with the score 34-15 Denver. On the other side of the break, Psycho Babble, Joy Collision and Hockey Honey wrapped up Amanda Sharpless long enough for Atomatrix to lap Sharpless in a 9-0 and make it a ten point game at 34-24.
A crowd-pleasing 19-0 for Heather Juska over a heavily harassed On Da Sligh opened up Denver's lead at 53-24; things continued to be very fast-paced through a 14-0 win for Atomatrix next. Psycho Babble took the Oly jammer star for the first time and picked a cheeky 4-0, getting Oly to within 11 at 53-42 with 13:20 in the first half.
The first power jam of the game was advantage Oly next when Heather Juska picked up a high block major as Denver jammer; the relentless Atomatrix took eight more points off the Denver lead and made it 53-50. She handed off the power jam to Psycho Babble, who did not get lead jammer but did get Oly in front again, 55-53, with about 10 minutes to play in the half.
Oly jammer On Da Sligh was absolutely on fire in the next frame, repeatedly spinning and leaping her way to freedom through Denver defense as Amanda Sharpless was bottled up by Scara to Death, Hockey Honey and Layla Lawdown. Sligh's 20-0 gave Oly their first double-digit lead of the game at 75-53.
Denver rallied slowly but surely, narrowing the score to 81-70 with just over 2 minutes left in the half. In the last jam of the half Psycho Babble, jamming for Oly, took lead but cut her way to the penalty box. Fortunately for Oly, a pack of Joy Collision, Lil Tonka, Scara 2 Death and Chica Chula worked over Heather Juska, with Joy having a particularly brutal hit that sent Juska nearly to the center of the infield. The power jam didn't narrow the margin at all -- when it was over, the halftime score stood at 88-77 Oly.
Oly started the second half jamming a tireless Atomatrix three times in a row in a sequence that went 14-8 Oly, 0-0 and 4-2 Denver to a new score of 104-89 after the first five minutes. Denver dedicated jammer Julie Adams saw her first action of the game in the second half and stole 2 points at the very end of a 4-2 to On Da Sligh that made it 108-93. On the Oly side, Joy Collision also saw her first jammer action early in the second half - but her only outing with the jammer star saw her go the box very early. Opposing jammer Caitlin Krause navigated a consistently shrinking Oly pack to blow up the crowd by tying it up, 108-108, with about 20 minutes in the game.
Denver finally took the lead back on the next jam as Juska called off a 4-0 just in the nick of time; that kicked off a short but crowd-pleasing Denver rally that ended when Julie Adams, skating on power jam, handed back the advantage with a major track cut. With about 14 minutes to go, Denver was still barely up 126-120.
A chaotic 11-7 for Denver saw both jammers get boxed, leading to a new score of 136-127 Denver with 12 minutes in the game. However, when Caitlin Krause was boxed as Denver jammer on the next jam, Atomatrix hushed the fans with a huge 25-0 jam that put Oly back in the lead, 152-136. That proved the critical frame of the game.
Denver nicked away with back to back lead jammer calls, closing to 152-143 as Sandrine Rangeon pumped the crowd after a 4-0. Two jams later, a jammer penalty on Atomatrix allowed Rangeon to narrow it to just two points at 152-150 Oly. It looked like Heather Juska would put Denver in front on the other side of the power jam -- but a costly 4th minor ended her run early. The jam ended 161-155 Oly -- and led to a very long referee timeout, as Atomatrix apparently both committed a track cut major and successfully called off the jam while not lead. However, the next jam mysteriously started with a 3-1 pack favoring Denver but both jammers in the box and Atomatrix getting released first. Oly got out of what looked like a nightmare situation sitting pretty, up 164-155 with 2:29 to play.
Rangeon narrowed it to 164-159 next and Denver called their final timeout with 1:59 on the clock. On Da Sligh and Heather Juska took some time off that clock in a 0-0; the next jam started with 51 seconds on the clock. Juska went back out to face Atomatrix on that final jam, but when Atom claimed lead, Denver's chances were all but shot. Atom took one insurance pass in the remaining time and wisely hung back until period time expired before calling it; the final score was a 7 point win for Oly at 168-161.
Comments
definitely need an explanation on that final official timeout
Ok, Atomatrix committed 2 major penalties. It was claimed by the announcers that it was "ref error" I guess meaning that the ref had signaled to Atomatrix that she was lead when she wasn't. That's a pretty serious error for a ref to make. But if the decision was that the ref was in error, why would Atomatrix be sent to the box at all? And if sent to the box, why for like 5 seconds when Juska had to sit longer. I mean, you could say they gave Atomatrix 1 major instead of 2 and then she'd only have to serve as long as Juska, but then Juska should have been released first.
As has been said many times, it's hard to enjoy a sport when you don't understand what is going on.
Doing my part. .
. . to spread unsubstantiated rumors. The explanation I read on a FB post was that Atom was given 1 minute for a major track cut and was sent to the box. The refs then determined that Juska had to serve a minute for standing too early during a previous penalty. Juska going to the box releases Atom, Juska serves the same couple seconds Atom did.
That has to be classed as a rumor. As usual, little attempt is made to clear these things up in any official way. Sometimes refs are given a mike (like the one that didn't work at this tournament), sometimes a message is sent to the house announcers (which I seldom can hear over the crowd).
It would be nice if WFTDA had a habit of posting short summaries of confusing calls like this one. One or two sentences would go a long way to clearing things up.
Even better would be a screen and projector at the venue dedicated to posting penalties. I would think you could set up some drop down menues with player numbers and/or names and penalties. One person with a tablet by the penalty box or in the center could run it (and the reported elimation of minors removes a couple NSO's and the white board from the current team). It wouldn't clear up every question, "Illegal Procedure" covers a mulitude of sins, but would go a long way towards making the game more understandable and more enjoyable for the fans.
7.3.4.1
Did Juska's penalty have anything to do with her coach coming over and talking to her while the refs were sorting things out? I thought there was a rule forbidding communication with a boxed skater?
There is indeed:
7.3.4.1 - A penalized skater’s teammates, managers, and coaches may not at any time physically enter the designated penalty box area to communicate with the penalized skater
...that sure looked like that was happening.
There is a rule
but it doesn't prohibit communication. It prohibits the coach from "physically enter[ing] the designated penalty box area to communicate with the penalized skater." As long as that coach stays outside the lines of the box then there is nothing forbidding it.
Correct
Brand-Aid is correct on this. In a ref clinic, one of the examples of this rule given was if a coach wants to give a water bottle to a skater. That coach can stand outside the box, say "Here is your water bottle", walk into the box, hand it to her, walk out of the box, and then keep talking without any penalty. If the coach walks into the box, and says "Here is your water bottle" while handing it to her, then it's a penalty.
this rule caused accidental amusement
at a recent tournament I was NSOing when the head NSO, in the pre-tourney meeting, noted without thinking that "it's totally okay to pass water in the box".
Fair enough. However, didn't
Fair enough. However, didn't she stand up to talk to him? Was that the violation?
Perhaps, but not a major.
If we assume that the penalty box is the seat that she's in (as opposed to the taped in penalty box area), then yes she left it by standing up. However, she did it during an official time out which is only a minor penalty. So if she picked up another minute, it would have to have been her 4th minor.
a 4th minor RIGHT AFTER a 4th minor?
If Juska had just gone to the box for a 4th minor, how could she get ANOTHER 4th minor penalty for standing up?
All in all, that whole situation was so confusing and pretty much (I think) cost Denver the game.
I agree with what was said earlier; it is hard to enjoy a sport/game when you have no idea WTF is going on.
But that's not all of it
There's also the part where Atom supposedly successfully called off the jam when she wasn't lead and, according to the stream announcers, the refs took the blame and issued no penalty. That's a pretty fundamental and zero tolerance rule (6.13.19 - A Jammer successfully calling off a jam when she is not Lead Jammer) that doesn't allow for wiggle room to redirect blame to the refs that even inexperienced refs don't make a mistake on, so I am assuming that there was more to what went on in regards to that than what the announcers spoke about.
however
if the ref awards lead erroneously, and the jammer calls it off while thinking she is lead, there is no penalty.
Is that what happened?
Is that what happened? Because that's not what the announcers said and I am hoping that what happened is something like what you said (i.e. within the rules). So far I haven't heard anyone claim they know what happened.
i wasn't there
so i only have the feed to go by, and the rinxter stats, but sadly the rinxter score stats aren't available either.
it's just plausible that a jammer can call off the jam while not actually being lead and not get a penalty for it.
either way, it was a fun game to watch.
Wouldn't the track cutting
Wouldn't the track cutting major preclude Atomatrix from the ability to call off the jam anyway, if she were lead jammer, which she was not, and, therefore, since there is no penalty incurred for a lead jammer attempting to call off a jam, successfully or unsuccessfully, after being whistled to the penalty box, wouldn't the track cut have moved Atomatrix from the status of "non-lead-jammer-who-tries-to-call-off-the-jam" to "jammer of indeterminate leadness who is being sent to the penalty box, but, not realizing she is being sent to the penalty box, attempts to call off the jam?", and therefore not put her in a sitatuation where she was even able to draw a penalty for attempting to call off the jam, which she could not legally do, but did?
By the way, that was the
By the way, that was the greatest sentence i ever wrote. EVER.
that sentence
that sentence does a good job of summing up how fast things can happen on the track during a game.
I may be mistaken, but...
I’m 99% certain that a lead jammer can both successfully call off a jam and be sent to the penalty box.
1. Lead jammer is knocked to the infield.
2. Lead jammer places her hands on her hips twice, successfully signaling to the referee to call off the jam.
3. Lead jammer then re-enters the track, cutting around 2 skaters or the foremost opposing blocker.
4. The fourth whistle is blown.
In this case, the jam was successfully called off, and then the foul was committed before the actual end of the jam (fourth whistle). This is what I thought happened when I was watching it on the feed, but I may be completely off base.
No, i'm sure you're right.
No, i'm sure you're right.
yes, this was my impression
The video will help sort this out but what I saw was Atomatrix call off the jam then skate back onto the track before the 4th whistle blew, thus committing 2 major penalties. But the timing is important as she had to have both skates in bounds before the 4th whistle.
Standing or exiting?
The announcers said that Juska got the extra minute for standing too early. I don't see a penalty outlined for that in the WFTDA rules.
Was this a miscommunication, i.e., she actually exited too early, and the announcer misunderstood or misspoke? Or was there a major penalty assessed for standing too early?
If someone with first-hand knowledge could speak to that, and also to the lack of the illegal procedure major for Atomatrix, the derby world would just be so pleased!
I have seen standing too
I have seen standing too early be penalized as leaving the box early, as in effect you are not following the proper procedures (as you are only supposed to stand when instructed by the timer). There isn't a specific penalty for standing too early as you mentioned. Hopefully WFTDA publishes a rules clarification on this.
Time stopped
I've seen standing too early punished by stopping that skater's time and then continuing their time once they sit again. Much like their time not starting till they are actually sitting in the box, their time doesn't continue till they are once again sitting in the box. Basically, they don't get another minute since they haven't left the box (which would be the major), but instead they lengthen their stay in the box for ceasing to sit until they have actually been instructed to stand. I rarely ever work the penalty box myself (I tend to Penalty Track or Wrangle when I NSO) so I am by no means an expert on Penalty Box protocol.
Exiting!
Thanks to Draggin Lady for clearing this part up for me: Juska exited the penalty box early, which is totes a major penalty. The announcers got the words wrong.
I feel better, don't you?
More Sugar Daddy.
Despite missing several blatant Oly-incurred majors during the last half of the final period (not to mention Denver getting pinched by a couple of ridiculous and unwarranted major penalties that resulted in Oly-favored powerjams), whatever happened during that last penalty assessment for Atomatrix made me lose all faith in that particular ref crew. In all my years of watching derby, if a jammer successfully calls off the jam when she is not lead jammer, she gets a major illegal procedure penalty, goes to the box, and that's that. I personally have never agreed with the rule (I'd love to see a ref serve a minute in the box for a shitty call), but that's just how it is. And now, all of a sudden it's publicly noted as "ref error" and Atom gets released from the box while Juska is forced to continue to serve a penalty, leaving everyone to just stand there and scratch their heads? (Or passionately boo, going by the audio on the feed.) Oh, and let's not forget about that major cut.
The technicalities may be over my head on the nitpicking as to what happened, but from a fan's perspective I completely disagree with how that was handled (as did the room full of skaters/managers/coaches and refs that I was watching the bout with). And let's not forget the WFTDA.tv announcers doing a poor job of explaining what was going on (which shouldn't be faulted to them that much, as the issue stemmed from the ref crew on-site doing a poor job of explaining to them what was happening to relay to the viewers), so everyone watching the choppy, boat-interrupted feed at home was probably doing exactly what we were doing: Standing up, throwing our hands in the air and asking "What the hell is going on here?!", as we watch the clock tick down to the final minute of the tournament.
Throughout the weekend I thought the reffing was above average and very fair (as it should be), but that last game was a really shitty way to end a great weekend. Yeah, I know everyone is exhausted after three really long days of skating and reffing (I could barely function and all I did was watch bouts and eat potato chips all weekend), but how that end-game was handled is unacceptable, especially since it basically pushed the tides of the game in favor of one of the teams instead of being impartial. If you're going to fall apart and make the calls that were made during the last several minutes of that game then you shouldn't be reffing.
Atom released from the box?
EDIT: i was reminded she was in the box, just released sooner. So ignore the first half of this post :-)
She wasn't put in the box at all, was she?
That's the other reason this is all so confusing. Either
A) she successfully called off the jam as non-lead jammer: MAJOR
B) she did not actually call off the jam. But she cut the front-most blocker. MAJOR
Regardless if Jus stood up, or her coach talked to her in the box, Atom should have sat down however briefly.
Also, the rules don't say anything about penalizing a jammer for STANDING too soon. They mention exiting the box, but not standing. (7.4.4 - If a penalized Jammer exits the penalty box before she is officially dismissed by an official, she will be required to return to the box and serve any unserved time, no matter how small. Per Section 6.13.25 she will also be assessed a major penalty.)
Correct me if I am wrong
I know it is a penalty for trying to call off a jam if you are not lead (minor) and successfully calling of a jam if you are not lead (major). However, I have always felt the fault on the second one really lies on the jam ref for that jammer as he forgot she is not lead & blows 4 whistles by mistake. I know refs are human and make mistakes but honestly isn't it the refs fault that the jam was called & not the skater?
it's a problem
Many people feel the same way, the problem is the rules don't specify what should happen in the instance where the ref gets it wrong. I've always seen the major accessed regardless of the ref. And perhaps it was in this case, we really don't know what the calls were, and that's a problem.
As for how the rules should be clarified this makes a perfect example case. Assuming a ref makes a mistake in letting a team without lead call off a jam, who should be penalized? In this case, Oly got a significant advantage from this ref mistake. What should have happened is that Atom should have been forced to re-enter behind the skater who hit her out and Denver could have continued their scoring pass. So clearly, without the major penalty Oly benefits. You could argue that if the jam ref is incorrectly signalling lead and the jammer calls it off they should always take the penalty but then it could be argued that the ref mistake unfairly hurts that team. So basically the ref mistake is going to hurt someone, the question is who, and the rules need to clarify so whatever the case it's applied consistently.
When would it be right?
A jam ref whistling a jam dead when a non-lead jammer tries to call it is never going to happen without a mistake by the ref, right?
The onus is on the jammer not to try to falsely take advantage. Without any sort of ramification for successfully confusing your ref, hell, any jammer could try to call it off whenever they wanted and hope it worked....
An Interpretation
As I was in the building watching the bout, this is what I saw and an Interpretation.
As Atomatrix was calling it off, the Jam Ref was Signaling for a cut and I thought I saw him hold up 4 fingers as if to say "4th Minor" at the same time I heard 4 whistles.
My theory on all this is that the "ref error" was in the whistles, and as a ref I totally get it. You have in your mind the penalty and are about to call it when you see the jammers hands on her hips. Instinctively (because the Jammers drill it into us as jam refs that they want that call off as soon as possible and rightly so) he probably blew 4 when he fully intended to just blow the single blast. He never signaled a call off...only a penalty. Again, pure theory here, but I believe that they felt that it wasnt a successful call off as outlined in the IP majors section of the rules.
That crew out there was the best of the weekend and that was the only bout they worked on sunday. Sir Osis, Umpire Strikes Back, Cop A. Phil, and Collin Deshotz are all high level and high quality officials. All the bouts are high quality skaters playing a fast, physical game and I challenge anyone to step up and do a better job. Everyone loves to criticize officials. Plenty of leagues out there need good officials, step up and do it. Those arent replacements out there, those are level 4 and 5 officials that have been doing this for years and work with the highest level of skaters. They are also human and the jam ref made an error that I totally understand as someone who has been in that position before.
As for the leaving the Box penalty. That information is relayed to the Head referee through the Penalty box officials. If the skater left the box before she was told "done"...its a major. Knowing the penalty box officials protocol, there would be no penalty assessed if she didnt leave the box early. Those NSO's arent new and have worked many tournaments and bouts...they know their stuff.
Just my .02
well video will help
But there's no doubt in my mind that Atom called the jam, thinking it was off, then stepped back onto the track in front of the pack. The cut was definitely a major, and definitely after she called the jam off. The jam was called off, the only question is whether Atom re-entered before the 4th whistle and thus committed 2 major infractions or just 1.
instant replay
It was on the instant replay montage at the end of the game. She started to call the jam off from OOB and then reentered the track, in front of the pack, before the 4th whistle, while calling off the jam still.
Meaning no disrespect to our
Meaning no disrespect to our intrepid officials. sir!
Here is the current evolution of my question, which has moved completely into a general rules discussion and away from anything specific involving last night's game: 1) I freely admit that i never really paid attention to the fact that there was a taped-in penalty box area. I just sort of thought the "penalty box area" was the penalty box area; never gave it much thought. 2) I always assumed the intent of rule 7.3.4.1 was to keep the skater from communicating with, and being communicated to by, her team, as a punitive component of the penalty. Apparently, this is not so. However, here's my question: If a coach/teammate can effectively communicate with a boxed skater without crossing some piece of tape on the floor, and a coach/teammate can also enter the demarcated penalty box area legally ((as long as they don't talk)), what's the point of the rule? What is trying to be prevented by not allowing them to combine the action of being in the penalty box with the action of communicating with the player? You can be inside the line, and you can speak to the player, but you can't do both at once, why? What is the intent of the rule, then, if it's not to prevent boxed skaters from receiving communications from their team? I'm legitimately curious.
Whispers
To provide a punitive component of sorts: If you cannot be in the box to communicate, you cannot whisper that communication into your skater’s ear, depriving the opposing team of an eavesdropping opportunity. Any communication with a penalized skater is out in the open for all to hear.
Right then.
Right then.
Ref error
there are 2 potential outcomes when a non-lead jammer calls it off(successfully).
if the jam ref has called her lead ( erroneously), and is pointing at her, she thinks she is lead because of those actions.
the successful call off is not penalised.
this is taught by all level 5 refs i have had learning opportunities with. including, Dr Vroom, Rawk, Rev Riot, Judge Knot and Tootie Tinwhistle.
this is 'ref error'
if the jam ref is NOT signaling lead and the call off is successful, the penalty is assessed.
this is not 'ref error'.
there should not be an additional penalty for standing early in the penalty box, as mentioned earlier timing is stopped, the skater notified of this, and timing recommencing once she sits again.
if the skater is told 'done' early and leaves, again there is no additional penalty.
this is 'nso error'.
the previous descriptions of calling it off and getting the cutting are correct. once the call off signal has been given and the fourth whistle, the bout is still on, and penalties can still be assessed.
what everyone (including myself) seems to want clarification on is why/how Juska got an additional penalty.
Also
So, are we saying that what happened to Atom was, in fact, 100%, her being awarded lead erroneously? This is the detail that I am still unclear on, as the announcers never said it, and 75% of this thread has been speculation, but I don't know which 75%.
footage
i think once the bout footage is up and available we will know for sure.
or one of the officials in the game clarifies.
i am assuming that it is the case because that is when 'ref error' is applied to that situation.
i heard 'ref error' from the announcers, a jam after the incident.
Bout footage
Bout footage is up: http://wftda.tv/archives/2012-west-region-playoffs/bout-17-3/
I've watched it. I now know some of the proposed answers in here that didn't happen, but I still don't know what did happen.
Interpretations
This is what the announcers said:
"Atomatrix called off the jam incorrectly but will not be penalized as it was deemed the referee's fault. Juska left the penalty box early and is expected to be penalized for that."
This was about a jam later and it was clear that Juska had already served her time and been released.
In watching the replay several times (which is obviously an advantage the officials don't have):
1) The announcers said Juska earned a 4th minor back block. The penalty at that time that looks like it might be called a back block looks to me like it might have been a major as the skater went down to one knee afterwards.
2) Atomatrix was never awarded lead.
3) Atomatrix looks to have cut while she is trying to call off the jam, before the jam was whistled dead.
4) It is unclear who whistled the jam over and it isn't even entirely clear who called the penalty, although I think it was her jam ref (he's leaving the frame as it occurs).
5) I can't even tell if the penalty whistle occurs before or after the 4 whistles.
6) Juska leaving the box never occurs on camera, although there is lots of time away from the box. If I were to guess, though, I think that Juska called the timeout and in doing so left the box. Just after that moment the camera pans back and she's on her skates sitting down in the box.
So... no idea what happened.
EDIT: The more I watch, I'm thinking that the jam ref called the penalty, another ref misheard and thought he called the jam and echoed, which made it the other ref calling off the jam.
EDIT2: I think I see Juska's skates outside of the box as Atom is skating back to her bench at the end of the jam.
EDIT3: Definitely Juska's skates. White with pink accents and green wheels.
Investigative sports journalism
What I'm hoping is that DNN will do a little investigative sports journalism, request copies of the stats, talk to the officials, and figure out exactly what penalties went down here.
Copies of the stats
Copies of the stats for all the bouts are already online at rinxter.net
Recap
Here's what happened regarding the jam in question.
If you watch the footage, you will see that Juska is awarded lead jammer. You see blue jam ref signal lead and the male announcer announce it.
Shortly after, Juska is sent to the box for a 4th minor. (She sits at 1:12 on the jam clock.)
Atom is then the only jammer on the track. Headed into turn 3, you can see white jam ref NOT signaling lead for Atom. This is correct, as Juska was awarded lead.
Coming out of turn 4, Atom takes a major cut by coming around blue 307 before the 4th whistle blast. As blue 307 is the foremost opposing blocker on the track, this is a major cut. As Atom was NOT lead, and successfully called of the jam while not being signaled lead, this is a 2nd major.
There are 24 seconds left in the jam when Atom calls it. The jam was NOT over.
When Atom goes to sit in the box, Juska has served 48 seconds of her 4th minor one minute penalty. (Again, she sits at about 1:12 left on the jam clock. The jam ends at :24 second on the clock.) Juska, however, left the box early to speak with her coach and was awarded a 2nd minute. Her remaining penalty time then should have been 1 minute and 12 seconds.
The refs only award Atom a single major penalty (for the track cut) and inexplicably do NOT award her a second penalty for successfully calling off a jam while NOT lead (and NOT being signaled lead.) As such, Atom's minute cancelled Juska's minute, so the next jam starts with Atom being released immediately and Juska being released 12 seconds later. (Atom: 1 minute, Juska: 1 minute 12 seconds.)
What should have happened was that both jammers sat for 12 seconds, Juska be released, and then Atom be released 1 full minute later.
The other thing to note is that BEFORE Atom sits to serve her single track cut major, the announcers announce that she has served FIVE trips to the box. The major track cut was her 6th. The major for calling off the jam would have been her 7th and would have resulted in her being removed for the rest of the bout.
The footage confirms all of this.
Nice work.
Damn.
Actually
Even if they decided to give Atom a major for calling off the jam, which I think they got it right by not doing, it would have only been her 6th. The stats on rinxter will confirm she only went to the box 5 times.
Unofficial count
The announcers were using Rinxter for the penalty counts, but the officials were not (during the bout, at least), so we tried to be conscientious about calling those stats unofficial.
I am not convinced that Atom
I am not convinced that Atom called off the jam. I agree that she tried to call it off and that some ref called it off, but I don't agree that we know that it was her ref. If it was not her jam ref, then it should only be a minor.
Rules language
If the jam was called off because she was hitting her hips, does it matter who blew the first whistles?
The language is 'a jammer successfully calling the jam off when she is not lead jammer'.
That is vague enough that I think if she hits her hips, and as a result of that the jam is called, she's liable. However, that same vagueness also means that I could see it being interpreted differently.
EDIT: Also, in 3.4.6 it says 'until the referee whistles the end of the jam'. Section 9.2.6.2 says that 'a referee must call off a jam' when 'lead jammer calls off the jam by repeatedly placing her hands on her hips.'
Now, we have an article problem. 3.4.6 suggest a specific singular ref (but doesn't specify jam ref); 9.2.6.2 puts that responsibility clearly on any and all refs.
What does this teach us? That the rules in this area require a little clarification and refinement.
I don't disagree
I think you're right that there can be some clarification. What I think happened, however, was that the referee called it off due to thinking they heard the jam ref blow four whistles, when the jam ref only blew one whistle. In this case, I think the extra layer of the miscommunication provides enough buffer to excuse Atom. But I agree, this is an interpretation, and not clear as per the wording.
Rules call for a major.
She touched her hands to her hips repeatedly, which led to the jam being called off. Her jam ref was not signalling her as lead. Seems like a pretty cut-and-dry major penalty to me.
She did..
It was, in fact, her jam ref that called off the jam.
Source?
The jam ref was off camera when the jam was called, so from what source(s) can you verify this is so. Is there some official willing to go on the record? Right now, we're still flooding this forum with rumors.
I was standing like 15ft away
I was standing like 15ft away on the Denver bench
Refs actually got this one
Refs actually got this one 100% correct (as they usually do - much to my displeasure when I am certain they got it wrong).
ibid789 has it pretty much right. Juska gets her 4th minor and sits with 1:14 on the jam clock (4:09 on the period clock). Atomatrix commits the major cut with 3:22 on the period clock. You can see her jam ref signal a cut and wave her off with 1 finger. At no time does he place his hands on his hips indicating he is calling the jam. Atomatrix does place her hands on her hips as she is pushed out of bounds and rolls back in bounds in front of the foremost opposing blocker. Since she is not lead , the jam is still in progress so this is the major cut. The jam is blown dead at this point (3:22 on the period clock) and then an official timeout is called with 3:12 on the period clock.
I don't see Juska leaving the penalty box, but the officials say she did. From the time she sits until the jam ends is 47 seconds, leaving her with 13 seconds on her penalty. Leaving the box during the timeout, would give her a major penalty. She would be required to serve her remaining 13 seconds plus an additional minute, Per 7.4.10, Atomatrix should be immediately released and 1 minute deducted from Juska's time, leaving her with 13 seconds to serve.
The point that can be argued is whether or not Atomatix should have received a major penalty for calling off the jam when she was not lead. From what I can see and from what I have read here (granted some of it speculation), the idea is that the jam ref did not call the jam (knowing she was not lead) but another ref called the Jam upon hearing the jam ref's single whistle blast for the major penalty. In this case, it can be said that is was not Atomatrix's actions (placing her hands on her hips) that caused the jam to be called off but rather it was one ref's interpretation of what another ref was doing. It can be argued that the "other" ref would not have called the jam solely upon hearing the single whistle blast from the jam ref without seeing the jammer placing her hands on her hips. I would agree. It was the combination of seeing the jammer's actions and then hearing the whistle that made the other ref think the jam was being called and he/she whistled thinking he/she was whistling in unison (as all refs do on the jam ending whistle).
I would have to agree with the ref's call on this one though. Atomatrix's actions did not directly cause the jam to be called. It was a combination of her action AND the misinterpretation of one ref's thought about what another ref was doing. The "other" ref would not have called the jam based solely on Atomatrix's actions. He/she waited to see what the jam ref's call was. The fact that the "other" ref misinterpreted the jam's call is a ref error and therefore Atomatrix was not awarded the penalty.
The clock times are what I saw from the video and could be off by a second or 2 from what the officials recorded.
ibid798 was correct (times being approximate) except for the part about how the jammers should have been released. Per 7.4.10, the jammers were released exactly as they should have been.
As for whether or not the jam ref whistles the jam dead, I can't tell from the video and I wasn't there. Even if I were there, I doubt very much I could discern one ref's whistle from another. If the jam ref blew his whistle only 1 time and another ref chimed in with 4 whistle blasts, I don't know if anyone outside the center of the track could tell whether the jam ref blew once or 4 times.
Also don't forget, all the refs blow their whistles in unison when a jam is called off. If the jam ref blew his whistle once for a major penalty and then heard 4 whistles coming from another ref, he would blow his whistle 4 times. For all he knows there is an injury on the other end of the track that he cannot see and one of the pack refs is calling off the jam for safety.
We really need to give all officials that work these tournaments a lot of credit. I watched/rewatched that video over a dozen times. This is not the first time a highly controversial call has been discussed in a long involved thread on DNN only to discover at the very end that the refs got it right. This is not to say they get everything right, but more often than not, they do.
And trust me, I have been displeased many a time then I thought absolutely positively they really screwed up because I know what happened. Only to find out after a ton of analyzing that the refs got it right in the 2-3 seconds they had to analyze it.