USARS Announces Tournament Dates, Locations
USA Rollersports announced Saturday the finalized dates and locations for their inaugural roller derby regional tournaments. Hosts were secured for six of USARS' nine regions; teams located in other regions may participate in any nearby region's event.
Dates and hosts
North Central
Five Flags Center (Dubuque, IA) September 21-23, 2012
Hosted by the Eastern Iowa Outlaws
Southwest
Stockton Indoor Sports Complex (Stockton, CA) September 28-30, 2012
Hosted by the Port City Roller Girls
Southeast
Virginia Beach Convention Center (Virginia Beach, VA) October 5-7, 2012
Hosted by the Resort City Roller Dolls
Great Lakes
Captain Dave’s Family Entertainment Center (Midland, MI) October 12-14, 2012
Hosted by the Chemical City Derby Girls
Southern
Mobile Civic Center (Mobile, AL) October 12-14, 2012
Hosted by the Deep South Derby All-Stars
Northwest
Kootenai County Fairgrounds (Coeur d’Alene, ID) October 19-21, 2012
Hosted by the Snake Pit Derby Dames
USARS is currently accepting team applications to participate in these events. Applications are due Monday, August 27.
USARS is currently considering host applications for their first ever roller derby national championship; dates and location will be announced shortly.
Comments
Anyone who wants a quick visual rundown...
I placed all these on a Google Map.
http://goo.gl/maps/ko3GI
It will be interesting to see...
It will be interesting to see just what kind of turnout these tournaments get.
Dear USARS
http://cdn.memegenerator.net/instances/400x/25428568.jpg
Dear WFTDA
http://cdn.memegenerator.net/instances/400x/25428568.jpg
Toché, WindyMan
I offer another popular meme as a retort.
http://i49.tinypic.com/mbid85.jpg
Could be worse
It could have a pack definition based around the foremost group of blockers.
Let's just wait and see, yeah?
The USARS rules could suck. They could be brilliant. But what they'll probably be is a mixture of both.
If their initial tournament turns out to be terrible I'll dish out the appropriate criticism for it. However, I know that any problems that come up in their rules will be addressed in a matter of months.
Not years.
Just a thought...
The USARS rules could suck. They could be brilliant. But what they'll probably be is a mixture of both.
If their initial tournament turns out to be terrible I'll dish out the appropriate criticism for it. However, I know that any problems that come up in their rules will be addressed in a matter of months.
Not years.
Right, because "democracy is the worst form of government except all those other forms." Finding out what the membership feels strongly about, coming up with options that please enough of them and voting on them is wasted time!
Do you know how many USARS leagues voted to choose the USARS rules? Maybe just the folks who were appointed to the committee? If the answer's to be found anywhere, it's buried somewhere on a web site that's even trickier to find things on than their old one.
Derby democracy
Right, because "democracy is the worst form of government except all those other forms." Finding out what the membership feels strongly about, coming up with options that please enough of them and voting on them is wasted time!
Do you know how many USARS leagues voted to choose the USARS rules? Maybe just the folks who were appointed to the committee? If the answer's to be found anywhere, it's buried somewhere on a web site that's even trickier to find things on than their old one.
No USARS leagues voted on USARS rules, because, uh, there are no USARS leagues yet. (Well, one league.) But I don't see how that's relevant to the discussion of whether or not the USARS roller derby rule set is any good.
But since you brought it up, consider this: There are 156 member leagues that get a full vote on WFTDA rules with 92 apprentices on their way to getting one. But there are a thousand leagues that, through lack of other options, skate by WFTDA rules that do not get to vote on how to change them. (This includes the MRDA.) To them, is that really a democracy?
Unaffiliated leagues are the true majority in roller derby, and if (...IF) USARS doesn't screw things up then all of a sudden this true majority will gain a vote: A vote to keep playing WFTDA rules they can't directly change, or a vote to adopt USARS (or MADE/OSDA/whatever) rules they can't directly change.
I don't understand what the problem is. If you give a league a good set of rules and the opportunity to play other leagues nearby or enter events/tournaments, they'll do it even if they didn't have a say in the process. (All they care about in the end is having fun playing roller derby.) It's already been happening with the WFTDA, so I don't see what the big deal is about USARS doing it, too.
I thought anyone with a USARS club is a USARS team
According to USARS, anyone that has an active club charter for 2012 is a USARS team. This was information our league (Sintral Valley Derby Girls) received when we were asked if we wanted to participate in the southwest regionals. The invite was also sent to all other active clubs in the region, from what we understood. Also last fall about 5 teams from each region tested the rules and offered suggested changes. Some changes were made to the rules based on suggestions made by the teams... Don't get me wrong the rules have a long way to go.... But it will be fun to see what changes will be made after each set of regionals.
Influencing change
Also last fall about 5 teams from each region tested the rules and offered suggested changes. Some changes were made to the rules based on suggestions made by the teams... Don't get me wrong the rules have a long way to go.... But it will be fun to see what changes will be made after each set of regionals.
This is sort of what I was going on about. Just because a skater or a league doesn't have a direct vote on changing something doesn't mean they can't make a significant contribution to changing it. Just look at me as an example—I write a blog post about the pack rules, it blows up within the community, and it eventually gets incorporated into the USARS rules pretty much word-for-word due in part to that.
Basically, all the feedback USARS has been getting has gone directly to the people responsible for creating the rules. With the WFTDA, we're told to "contact your local WFTDA rep" if we want things changed. Problem is, leagues not affiliated with the WFTDA don't have a local rep, so they have to rely on someone else to (hopefully) enact any changes they may want. That is, if one WFTDA league and 10 non-WFTDA leagues disagree on how to change things in the WFTDA, guess which one holds sway in the end?
Point here is, just because an unaffiliated league doesn't get a vote to directly change things doesn't mean they can't directly influence change. There's a bigger barrier do this within the WFTDA than in USARS at the moment, or at least that's my impression.
There are lots of ways to do democracy
... but Committee of the Whole is not the most spectacularly effective method for adopting substantive reform.
DNN and USARS tournaments
I see DNN's logo is on the poster for the Southwest USARS tournament. Will DNN be streaming the tournament?
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10151177747526963&set=a.28760881...
I second that inquiry
Because I've been trying to get a hold of Port City to film it myself if DNN wasn't doing it.
(If you're doing a webcast announce, can I get in on that?)
USARS broadcasts
We've been approached by several of the USARS tournament hosts for help with basic internet broadcasting. Mobile is definitely going to happen, and Port City is very likely too -- might like to put you to work, if you're game?
I might be able to do North Central
It looks like I'm likely to be in the neighborhood of Dubuque at the same time as the USARS North Central tournament. So put me down to possibly shoot that one. Assuming the locals want any help, of course. I don't think I know ANYONE from Iowa, much less the Eastern Iowa Outlaws roller derby league.
Noted!
Pretty good likelihood they'll want to take you up on that, pending verification of internet at the venue.
I'm game
might like to put you to work, if you're game?
Sure, I'll do what I can. How hard could it be?
visually speaking
that is quite possibly one of the worst posters i have ever seen...
is that's any indication of quality of these events...yikes
Location for National Championships
USARS is currently considering two locations for Champs: Albuquerque, NM and Fresno, CA. The date is tentatively Dec. 14-16.
http://www.teamusa.org/USA-Roller-Sports/Features/2012/August/23/USARS-R...
The main issue with USARS
is that it isn't international and excludes well over half the world. I know a lot of sports are like this. But with truly international sports like this it should be. Same as football.
exactly!
Let me make sure I understand. The main issue with USA Roller Sports is that they limit themselves to roller sports in the USA? Are you proposing that we should expand the USA to include the world, or that there should be another organization that governs all roller sports on Earth (maybe call it Earth Roller Sports)?
It seems to me that the main issue with USARS is that they're the ones taking roller derby to the Olympics, and yet approximately 0.0% of athletes who say they want roller derby in the Olympics are members of USARS roller derby teams yet.
Not the Olympics nonsense again...
It seems to me that the main issue with USARS is that they're the ones taking roller derby to the Olympics, and yet approximately 0.0% of athletes who say they want roller derby in the Olympics are members of USARS roller derby teams yet.
The Olympics are what they use as the unreachable carrot-on-stick to suck money out of the wallets of skaters and parents of for the rest of their (dying) disciplines. While they invited the best speed skaters to switch to ice instead (Apollo Ono was one, Atomatrix failed to make the cut).
FIRS has not had ONE single success in getting a regular event in any Olympic games, ever. They have on the other hand gotten roller hockey in once as a demonstration sport. That was 1992 in Barcelona (as quad hockey is huge in Spain). Quad hockey hasn't been asked back as a regular event in the past 20 years. Speed, figure, etc have never been in at all. Might be as they're seen as a poor cousin of existing winter events?
The world's best-known inline speed coach seemed to think derby's got a good chance though... You might disagree with his stated reason why. Some of the problems derby would likely face as far as Olympics inclusion come from within the skating world. Longtime speed skaters like him tend to hate roller derby passionately. Not only because it suggested a connection between speed to the fake sport our real one sprang from (one reason why USAC/RS didn't allow speed skaters to wear helmets back in the 70s, per Sports Illustrated), but because once upon a time fake derby offered a paying gig that could lure skaters away from "real skating."
Anyways, once and for all, roller derby is NOT under consideration for Olympics inclusion. Roller sports is, and some folks (including USARS, who appear to be doing it for their usual reasons) have stretched that into roller derby being specifically under consideration. Though considering FIRS' track record over the past 20+ years, I wouldn't hold my breath.
I am so glad that you're around.
You bother to know the things no one else has the patience to even be interested in if those things conflict with their prejudices.
I sincerely hope that you write a book or publish a comprehensive blog.
Olympics nonsense
Indeed, FIRS is working for the xth time to get roller sports into the olympics. It is FIRS that will decide in their bid what roller sports they want in the olympics. Apart from some wishfull thinking from some in the roller derby world, and some carrot on the stick strategy from USARS, i have never nowhere seen any indication that FIRS is considering to propose roller derby as one of the roller sports for the olympics.
When I check your link Bill Begg does not seem to think derby's got a chance. It's a post in a forum from 2 years ago where he rants about the quality of the sports that got chosen for the olympics, he says they are all fake and ends ironically with 'Roller Derby will get in , as its a play acting sport, just for show' (Bill never liked derby).
Bottom line, i disagree with you on a top speed coach thinging roller derby has a chance. But i fully agree with you that roller derby in the olympics is no more than wishfull thinking.
I'm not holding my breath
I think my comment may have come off wrong. As a fan, I personally don't care one bit about roller derby in the Olympics. I like derby, but the Olympics games don't do anything for me. HOWEVER, there seem to be a lot of skaters and fans who are excited about the possibility of derby going to the Olympics in their lifetime, and it seems that the only way that could possibly happen is through USARS, not WFTDA.
Even though USARS is just a tiny blip, if it weren't for the Olympics carrot-on-a-stick, USARS roller derby wouldn't be on anybody's radar at all. What I was trying to point out is that USARS' biggest problem isn't that they're not an international organization, but that nobody is skating under their rules.
ps. I've never been downvoted on DNN until today. Now my feelings are all hurt. :-(
If you want something done right
You have to do it yourself
Just because FIRS/USARS have established themselves as the governing body for rollersports, it is not impossible for an international governing body for roller derby to be recognized as well (we can land a Mars rover, but adding an international federation is impossible?). How did they stake a claim to derby anyway, simply by adding it to their website? Now derby is all theirs? Do you see anything wrong with this? http://www.rollersports.org/RollerSports/rollerderby/index.html
Take a look at the governing bodies similar to FIRS, I'm not even bothering with USARS but going 'all the way to the top', after all if the Olympics is what you're after. USARS has NO say in what may be included only FIRS.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Association_of_the_IOC_Recognised_Internati...
In particular, see how many martial arts there are, judo/taekwondo are already in the summer games, but there are karate & wushu as well. The different disciplines do not just fall neatly into martial arts, but are managed under different federations. Why does derby have to fall under roller sports? Because someone came up with a generic enough name? What if I said derby is a roller fighting sport for example, that changes the definition right? Take a look at Bandy, doesn't that look like ice hockey?
List of 2020 sports under consideration:
baseball, karate, roller sports, softball, sports climbing, squash, wakeboard and wushu
Which one of the above has more than one discipline under its belt? Wakeboard has two and mentions it directly. waterski & wakeboard federation. How many does FIRS have? 9. When it comes time to choose, which sport do you think will be chosen? The new and emerging or the more well established/longer history? When it comes time for your federation/governing body to submit their sport, do you want a 1/1 chance of your sport being heard, or do you want a 1/9 chance?
Think before taking a bite of that carrot.
USARS/FIRS
Just because FIRS/USARS have established themselves as the governing body for rollersports,
The IOC designated FIRS as the international sanctioning body for rollersports and gave FIRS the mandate over roller derby. FIRS, in turn, has designated USARS as the US national sanctioning body for rollersports and thus, for roller derby as well. USARS did not designate themselves.
But this is only germane if the goal is to go to the Olympics. If the Olympics are not the goal, then there's no issue and the existing competitive structure is fine.
However, if the Olympics does become a goal, it may be necessary to forge a working relationship with USARS. Baseball, hockey and basketball have all done it, even as their sports may or may not have had issues with the international regulations. Baseball, for instance, has been in and out of the Olympics a few times, and hockey rules are slightly different in international play than in NHL play.
When did this happen?
"The IOC ... gave FIRS the mandate over roller derby"
AFAIK, FIRS just decided to in include roller derby as one of their disciplines after a presentation from USARS and there was no ruling from the IOC specifically for roller derby. E.g Federation of Ski ruling over Federation of Snowboarding. FIRS simply has blanket monopoly on everything roller skating. If I come up with a new sport involving roller skating and basketball, it by default has to go through FIRS for it to be Olympic possible because it involves roller skating? All I'm suggesting is that there may be more than one way to achieve the desired goal. It's probably a lot harder but I don't think paving your own way is impossible either. Just think about it more before going with the status quo.
Also baseball, hockey, and basketball all have their individual international federations. There's not one governing all sports with a ball or a puck. Unlike the NBA, the WFTDA is international.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Association_of_Summer_Olympic_International...
Skating
Yeah, I never understood that. I think I should start a FIBS: Fédération Internationale de Ball Sports, and claim that soccer, football, baseball, basketball, volleyball, etc. are all under my jurisdiction.
To be honest, this is what USARS is trying to do. Imagine a FIBS who says "Hey, we've got this slight variation on soccer rules. We've taken out offsides and we let the visible clock be the official clock instead of the one on the field. This is our version of soccer, even though a) most of the world plays by a different version and b) the top players/teams play under a different version." I'm pretty sure it would have to take some serious backroom deals to let the IOC even talk to them, and yet this is exactly what USARS has done.
Clarification on 2020 Olympic rollersports
One of the people on the USARS derby committee made it known that roller derby is not and was never under consideration for the rollersports discipline up for inclusion for the 2020 Olympics. Inline speed skating is USARS' main push for next year's vote, which has nothing to do with their newly-created (and very different) roller derby arm.
USARS Roller Derby has, presumably, known this from the very start of their endeavor. They are well aware of their place in the grand scale of things and know the reality of what it will take for Olympic derby to be a reality. That is, they ("they" being the skaters and derby folk on the USARS derby sport committee, not necessarily USARS on the whole) are not going to slash and burn their way to get there at any cost.
The work their roller derby arm is doing is being done under the assumption that their rules, once they work out the initial kinks, will be adopted by their international body, FIRS, who will then present them as *the* standard for international competition worldwide as (indirectly) recognized by the International Olympic Committee and other world games organizations. They could do that with the WFTDA rules too, if other countries present them to FIRS as an idea for a standard. Who knows at this point.
But the assumption is that the U.S. will get priority on derby rules since we, y'know, kind of invented the sport and have the most people playing it at the moment. That means FIRS will look to USARS first, and probably exclusively, for guidance on that.
anyone hear how many applications there were?
I noticed the deadline for teams to apply to the USARS regional tournaments was yesterday (August 27). Has anyone heard how many applicants there were? It would be disappointing if they set up all these tournaments, and nobody came.
the southwest USARS tournament
the southwest USARS tournament is about a two hour drive from where I live. I've been keeping an eye on their facebook event page... as of last Friday they have announced 7 teams
Grim Reap-Hers out of Merced
San Diego Roller Derby Rockstars
the Sintral Valley Derby Girls
Resurrection Roller Girls Cinderollas,
Port City Roller Girls
Sactown Smacktown Hades Ladies
https://www.facebook.com/events/272730106161115/
Oly going to NW USARS regional
Yup, it's true. Your 2009 WFTDA Champions, the Oly Rollers, are going to the USARS regionals. Let's see if they can go for the double.
not surprised
I'm looking forward to watching Hockey Honey play FOR Oly in the WFTDA Championship and AGAINST Oly in the USARS Championship.
I am super peeved about this....
The part of the discussion that keeps pissing me off is the assumption that just because USARS makes their own ruleset that it will somehow become the "recognized" ruleset for international roller derby. Cause, you know, FIRS is owned by USARS??!
GUYS - USARS ONLY HAS POWER IN AMERICA.
And guess what, while roller derby may have come from America and the US still has the "most" teams - roller derby is no longer just a US game. I mean I know you all KNOW this, but do you really get it?
While USARS is trucking along with their quest to own derby, meanwhile us folks in the rest of the world are working with our own national organisations to establish governing bodies for roller derby without the lovely input of USARS - cause, you know, they can't do anything about derby outside of the US (shocker).
So while I recognize they have some inate power being the all powerful US rep, they in no way own all of roller sports across the world. They can certainly put forward their own suggested ruleset for roller derby - but until a bigger process takes place that involved way more than just one country they are not going to control derby across the world. And they are really not having any influence on it either.
Do you know what ruleset the teams in the rest of the world play by? The WELL ESTABLISHED and the quickly sprouting new teams across the world? WFTDA.
Does this mean everyone is all up in WFTDA and is blinded to anything else? No of course not. But let's be realistic about how much power USARS actually has here. I can assure you that most other countries do not take kindly to some bulldozing US national organisation telling them how they can operate.
So you know, have fun with that USARS national championship. If they want to get a world champ going with their crowned champ...they are going to have the play by the ruleset that the rest of the world plays by.
International roller derby will save your souls.....
Hooray for International Roller Derby
:)
ZOINKS!
The part of the discussion that keeps pissing me off is the assumption that just because USARS makes their own ruleset that it will somehow become the "recognized" ruleset for international roller derby. Cause, you know, FIRS is owned by USARS??!
GUYS - USARS ONLY HAS POWER IN AMERICA.
And guess what, while roller derby may have come from America and the US still has the "most" teams - roller derby is no longer just a US game. I mean I know you all KNOW this, but do you really get it?
While USARS is trucking along with their quest to own derby, meanwhile us folks in the rest of the world are working with our own national organisations to establish governing bodies for roller derby without the lovely input of USARS - cause, you know, they can't do anything about derby outside of the US (shocker).
So while I recognize they have some inate power being the all powerful US rep, they in no way own all of roller sports across the world. They can certainly put forward their own suggested ruleset for roller derby - but until a bigger process takes place that involved way more than just one country they are not going to control derby across the world. And they are really not having any influence on it either.
Do you know what ruleset the teams in the rest of the world play by? The WELL ESTABLISHED and the quickly sprouting new teams across the world? WFTDA.
Does this mean everyone is all up in WFTDA and is blinded to anything else? No of course not. But let's be realistic about how much power USARS actually has here. I can assure you that most other countries do not take kindly to some bulldozing US national organisation telling them how they can operate.
So you know, have fun with that USARS national championship. If they want to get a world champ going with their crowned champ...they are going to have the play by the ruleset that the rest of the world plays by.
International roller derby will save your souls.....
Man, London has been pissed since the Olympics ended....Lol!!
At Betty::::Agreed...& don't worry......No one organazation will ever control everything....USARS is testing the waters. Good for them. The more in, the better it will become someday....until then, we all just muddle through...
Rev
Officiating
Who will be officiating these tournaments? What process have they undergone to ensure quality and consistency? How many USARS inter-league bouts have they officiated prior to officiating at the tournament level?
Further, what is the process for teams providing review and oversight in officiating?
curious
I'm curious about that, too. I'm planning to go to the North Central tournament, and - as the volunteer in DNN's "volunteer powered" equation - I'll try to get the scoop and report back to the Derbyverse (tm). I just saw on Facebook that the NC tourney has been reduced from three days to one. There aren't a lot of teams, but it'll still be cool to be able to say that I went to THE VERY FIRST USARS regional roller derby tournament in history.
I'd guess the officials can't possibly have too much experience at USARS inter-league bouts, since there have been so few bouts under the USARS rules in the first place.
Crawl before you walk
From what I gather, nobody involved has any illusions that any of these events are going to be smooth sailing. The basic sentiment I'm picking up seems to be that, despite the obvious challenges, there's a critical mass of skaters who are looking for what's on offer. Based on that, they're going to go ahead and get together, play some games, get some experience, shake loose the bugs on the fly (just like any other ruleset has done).
What will the result be? Some of the events have contacted us for assistance broadcasting (which we provide to anyone in derby who wants to learn!), so we'll all get the opportunity to watch and see.
I think we're all clear on the idea that modern roller derby has a lot more evolving to do before it arrives at a truly stable state. Speaking only for myself, I think multiple avenues of exploration is probably the best way to get there fastest.
SW Regional schedule
click on "Event Schedule"
http://www2.teamusa.org/USA-Roller-Sports/Roller-Derby/Roller-Derby-Even...
Quick video of USARS gameplay
From a co-ed scrimmage being played by Deep South Derby, who will be in the Southern USARS regional.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PCO3jH159T8
USARS Ruleset
I saw the beta test game between the Charlotte Speed Demons and the Greenville Derby Dames. It was at least a year ago now ,and I don't know if/how the rules were updated. I liked the blocker box to start the jam, but was really confused by the rules for jammer, even after watching it. From what I remember, if someone is called lead jammer, the opposing pivot could take off and be the jammer (without a star pass), and generally that meant that the team with lead would be forced call it off. Getting lead seemed to be a disadvantage, because either the pivot or the jammer could then follow the lead jammer out of the pack, and get into scoring position. It's been a while, and maybe they have changed the rules about this, but that's my recollection. The other weird thing was the stopping and waiting on the track for the pack. If someone moved out of play in the front of the pack, they had to wait until the pack caught up. Sometimes this took a while. But overall, the "feel" was similar, even though the details were not.
I don't know these teams and haven't read the USARS ruleset, but
As someone who started with WFTDA but has played by the MADE ruleset this 'disadvantage' of getting lead just sounds like skaters who aren't used to a pivot break. I really struggle with remembering that as a blocker you have to sit on both the jammer AND the opposing pivot. The players used to playing with that ruleset have MUCH better pack awareness and know where both players are.
If you keep the jammer in the pack and continue to control the pivot then neither gets out and your jammer can continue scoring unopposed. Obviously it's harder to hold 2 players back so in MADE it's rare that a jammer chooses to go for more than one pass, let alone gets many lap points because either the jammer or pivot eventually breaks. But that's a big reason why you see lower scoring and closer games with the MADE rules. It's also worth noting that if USARS uses MADE lead jammer rules, you have to fight to keep lead jammer status, so it's not lead jam status that would be the 'disadvantage' it would be 'the first to break the pack.'
What this means for the USARS tourneys... maybe some ugly games if the teams aren't preparing properly and really learning the strategy of the ruleset they'll be playing under. Or maybe some less skilled teams who are smart enough to use that ignorance to upset some higher level skaters.
You were confused watching...
I played in that Beta test game. We were given a few weeks to read and learn the rules, and seemed that we knew them better than the refs did, which don't we always ;). Ok I tease, but seriously mucho confuso!! Scoring points every time you passed the penalty box even though you haven't even reached the pack again. How does that prevent running up the score, willy nilly giving unearned points away. Jammer or pivot can be the point scorer, without a panty pass. I know they were trying to take one thing and try to make it better, faster, stronger, but it seems that they took some things a little too literally and a little too far. I will stick to WFTDA. But I suppose if USARS was all I knew, I would be just as head over heels for them as I am for WFTDA. I will say I did enjoy one whistle starts, and the blocker box, but did not like having to wait for the pack to catch up, or having the ability to force the jammer to the back of the back with a turning toe stop run back. All this being said....kudos to the growing force that is USARS!