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ECDX: Toronto Overcomes Maine, 148-120

FEASTERVILLE, PA -- The only North Central team present at the ECDX, 15NC Toronto, had a significant cheering section among the Canadians who'd also come down to support Montreal, and gave those fans something to cheer for when they took down 11E Maine in a fairly well-matched game, 148-120.

Although Maine led for nearly the entire first half, Toronto consistently got points on the board every time that it looked like Maine was on the verge of pulling away. After the opening ten minutes, Maine led 35-10; with 3 minutes left to play in the half, Toronto was nicking away at the lead and had it down to 17 points at 57-43. The Canadians won the last two jams, a 10-0 followed by a 14-8 power jam, and took the lead for the first time at the break, 67-65.

Maine went ahead again at 72-69 about five minutes deep in the second half, then got a big 18-0 from Grim D Mise that ended with Toronto losing their jammer; Crystal Whip added 9 more on the other side of the jammer advantage and suddenly Maine had their largest lead at 99-69 with about 20 minutes to play.

Once again, though, Toronto would not let Maine establish breathing room. A massive-advantage power jam gave Toronto's Bruiseberry Pie the chance for a 23-0 and Rebel Rockit added 19-0 to follow on another Maine jammer penalty. Two jams after Maine had their largest lead of the game, Toronto had their largest lead of the game at 112-99 with 12 minutes to play.

Two jams later Toronto had extended their lead to 123-100, but caught an extremely tough break when their jammer Rebel Rock-It attempted to call the jam while not lead, picking up her 4th minor by doing so; Maine ace Grim D. Mise picked up a 20-point pile to close it to 123-120 Toronto with 6:46 on the clock.

Unfortunately for Maine, Grim went to the box in the waning seconds of the jam, setting up a critical power jam opportunity for Toronto. It got worse for Maine when Grim returned to the box soon after being released; Toronto's Kookie Doe blew up the scoreboard on a 20-0 that perfectly answered Maine's big jam. With 4:12 to play, Toronto was up 143-120.

The next two jams went 0-0, helping Toronto kill time to the 1:59 mark. The game ended somewhat oddly as Maine jammer Kissy Kicks was clearly hurt early in the jam and removed herself from play only to unsuccessfully attempt to finish the jam; Rebel Rockit claimed lead for Toronto and skated out the jam with a 5-0 to give Toronto the win, 148-120.

Bout stats via wftda.tv.


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O Canada!

Nice! With this, Old Capitol City, and Brewcity results, the NC 10 spot is really up for grabs!

Grim D. Mise

As someone who doesn't see a lot of east coast derby, it was a real treat to watch Grim D. Mise today. She rocks.


Also adding: I have a soft spot in my heart for the Maine Port Authorities.


I might have to give up my Canadian passport, but I'm complelled to say that Grim is a joy to watch.

yeah, they are super awesome.

yeah, they are super awesome. :) who doesn't love them?!


more funny cat pics

Here, let me embed that for you - Editor

Should Toronto be ranked above Brewcity?

I think that there is a good case for Toronto being moved into the number 10 position, in the North Central, and moving Brewcity out of the top 10.

First order comparison

I wrote a post comparing these two teams, but it vanished into the aether. A first order attempt at comparing these teams has them with one opponent in common in 2012: Ohio. Both lost, but the differentials/ratios slightly favor Toronto. Pretty small difference for a good comparison though.

EDIT: And dang, that was supposed to be in response to Captain Lou's comment comparing Toronto and Brewcity.

If we are going to use a losing point

Differential to determine the number 10 spot then really that spot should go to tri city. They had a respectable loss against Ohio this month. Just saying :)

Toronto, Tri-City, Brewcity

While Ohio is the only primary datapoint between Toronto and Brewcity, there are 5 primary datapoints for Toronto and Tri-City . In the losses to Ohio, Tri-City does indeed come out ahead of Toronto. In victories over Burning River, Toronto gets the nod. Toronto also gets the nod with a better win over Roc City. The Hammer CIty results are a draw in my books. Then, most importantly, you have the head to head action, where Toronto also gets the nod over Tri-City.

If Tri-City had beaten Burning River by a greater margin then an argument could be made that the loss to Toronto is outweighed by the better performances by Tri-City. That did not happen though. Is there an argument that Tri-City should be ranked ahead of Brewcity? Perhaps.

The biggest comparative problem for Toronto and Brewcity is that Toronto went 9-1 on the season while Brewcity went 1-4 with a 2 point win over Bleeding Heartland. Are Brewcity's "quality" losses better than Toronto's wins?

That is a tough question to answer. If you take the Burning River result, Toronto beat Burning River by 33, The Outfit beat Burning River by 17 (in the same weekend) and, three weeks later, The Outfit beat Brewcity by 11. Is this a relevant piece of data?

Brewcity has a good result against Minnesota with a 69 point loss. However, at Brewhaha, Brewcity lost to Detroit by 37 and then Detroit went on to lose to Minnesota by 160. Does this change this "quality" level of the Brewcity loss from earlier in the season?

Toronto's best result, this season, is the win over Maine, but that is out of region. They also beat Queen City and Roc City from out of region. Their win over Tri-City is somewhat relevant since Tri-City has beaten the #11 in the North Central, Grand Raggidy (who also happen to have beaten Bleeding Heartland by 2 points). Their best in-region result, ranking wise, was against Fort Wayne, ranked 14th. With all of the jumbling that will be done with the Q2 rankings, are these wins enough to move Toronto into the top 10?

Frankly, I'm glad I don't have to do the rankings. It will be interesting to see what the leagues come up with.


Rankings aside, I'm extraordinarily impressed with Toronto's CN Power. While they lack star power (in terms of someone with the Atomatrix-like ability to single-handedly change games on behalf of their teams) they bring a very efficient, effective blend of physicality and intellect to their bouts. As a coach, the solidity and consistency of their game plan caught my eye right away. I intend to pay them the highest compliment of all - lifting some of their moves for my team, haha. Props on a great season so far CN Power!

Star power they haz

Actually, at ECDX Toronto was without two of their top jammers: Bambi (broken wrist against Ohio) and Defecaitlin, who injured her knee in a home team bout. Caitlin put up a 39 point jam in April against Hammer City. Not taking away anything from the group that won both bouts at ECDX, but with those two jammers in the lineup you would have had your star power. Injuries aside, even if they don't crack the top 10 - and Lou makes a compelling case - Toronto is pretty stoked about their 9-1 record in their first full season as a WFTDA squad.

Defecaitlin and 39 point jams

It should also be pointed out that Defecaitlin managed 2 jams of 39 points against the Fox Cityz Foxz at Brewhaha. She really needs to try harder to get over that 40 mark.

Tri City

If we're going into the comparisons between Tri City and Toronto, don't forget Tri City won to Grand Raggidy by 32 while Toronto lost to GR by 80 within the last year. And yes it's true Toronto took the win over Tri City but lets remember this was very early in the season and a lot has changed, granted for both teams, since then.

Toronto and Tri-city

Yes it is true Toronto lost to GR but that was 8 months ago while the win over Tri-city was 3 months ago

Toronto & TriCity: An argument for wild cards

Regardless of the March Tri-Toronto game result, if we use DNN logic (what would happen if these two teams were to play tomorrow?) I don't think there's a clear answer.

Having played both these teams and then watched them at BrewHaHa, I have admired their respective strengths. Like Madison this season, the problem with evaluating Toronto or TriCity comes down to not enough in-region competition over the course of the season to make sufficient comparison.

...which really makes me wish for regional tournament wild cards. It seems like a logical step given that, due to travel distances and finite finances, some teams can't book the seasons they'd like. There will always be an additional hardship for up & coming/recently apprentice teams trying to book games against higher-ranked opponents, which is why people feel they can't justify a top 10 ranking for an emerging team over a more seasoned team or one with higher caliber opponents. Hence, wild cards provide a great opportunity to involve teams that may not have secured a top 10 ranking given their season makeup, but have demonstrated sufficient strength or growth to earn a shot.

"Wild card" isn't quite the right term

(I'm not saying this to call you out, more because I just like to put derby in the context of traditional sports)

"Wild card" refers to teams that make the playoffs even though they did not win their division or region during the regular season. You could say that at WFTDA Championships, the "wild card" teams are W2, W3, E2, E3, NC2, NC3, SC2 and SC 3. The term doesn't really neatly carry across to the WFTDA regional playoff structure, though. In baseball, for example, a team wins the AL East at the end of the regular season, before the playoffs, but we won't have considered, say, Gotham or Texas to have won their respective regions until *after* the playoffs.

What you're really asking for is not wild-card teams, but expanding the regional tournaments to 12 teams. Which seems like it would create the same problem, just two more teams down the line.

Other sports employ wild cards differently

I see what you're saying in relation to baseball, but other sports employ different strategies for selecting wild cards. In tennis, for example, sometimes they give wild cards to up & coming young players or formerly high-ranked players coming back from injury/a break a position in a tournament like Wimbledon, regardless of their ranking. Beyond the top-ranked teams, Major League Soccer tried giving wild cards to the teams that had scored the most points over the course of the season. I understand that neither of these perfectly map to the playoff structure of WFTDA, but it's food for thought.

Thus, I'm not suggesting that #11 and #12 necessarily go (that kind of takes the "wild" out of "wild card," IMHO), rather that up and coming teams that haven't had a chance to play/beat the appropriate teams in order to make their seeding get a chance. For example, maybe the #11 team has lost to #7, #8, #9 and #10, but perhaps #13 has been soundly defeating everyone ranked below them but hasn't had a chance to play anyone ranked immediately above them to be judged against those peers. Due to the nature of voting and triangulation in the WFTDA rankings, #13 may be kind of stuck in that position, but I might be inclined to nominate them for a wild card slot based on their performance.